Rushmore University

You Americans really make a name for yourselves. Absolute idiocy. It is no wonder you are the laughing stock of the world. Why we take what ever you have to say about any school when you can't even locate Canada on a map. You are the worst race on the planet and will be the end of us all. Anyone taking the word of the Neanderthals to heart need to remember level of intellectuality of the persons providing feedback.

You're jokes.
seriously.
Everyone else in the world, if you get what you need out of an education, and can deliver. More power to you. anyone who cant realize inadequacy when they see it, are probably American and need such laws to govern their lack of ability to manage a business because they are half wits who cant make their own decisions.

Really. are you people that concerned about theses morons????

Diploma mill, avoid!  Useless in any language.

But, Rushmore has books just like Harvard and students use pens, just like Harvard.

How can anyone possisbly separate the two?

harvard is not accredited either.

"harvard is not accredited either."

While your comment is blatantly false, it's also a great example of flawed logic.

So Harvard being unaccredited (which is false anyway) translates to Rushmore being an acceptable university due to their lack of accreditation?

Diploma Mill!!!!! Avoid!!!! Another Diploma Mill is Commonwealth Open 'University'. Both sell fake degrees.

If you are going to fake your degree, buy one from Rochville or Breyer State, they are cheaper.

All this post says is, if you live in America don't choose Rushmore.

Simple.

I don't disagree with everything you say but...

"this "university" is a one-man or two-man shop"

is plainly wrong.  I have met a Rushmore tutor in my country (not USA) and he is well respected in his field.  I checked this at a meeting I attended when I happened to bump into someone who new the tutor in a professional capacity.  He is well known, has worked at the CEO level before retiring, is/was a visiting professor at an established brick and mortar university and teaches at Rushmore.

I also contacted another one of the advertised tutors also from my home country and he too is very well established in his field (a highly respected profession).

So there are more than you think and as they are both mentioned on the faculty list I have no reason but to believe the others mentioned are also genuine.

As you say "do your homework."

oregonlive.com/opinion/index.ssf/2010/07/diploma_mills_lessons_from_the.html

Diploma mills: Lessons from the Galle and Colvin cases 
Published: Monday, July 19, 2010
By Alan Contreras - Aadministrator of the Oregon Office of Degree Authorization.

Here's the Top 10 sources of invalid degree reports or inquiries received by ODA: 

Almeda University 
Belford University 
Breyer State University 
Canyon College 
Corllins University 
MUST University 
Rochville University 
Rushmore University 
Washington International University

"Well they have said they are having to make changes to meet the requirements of accreditation."

No, they have been claiming that for years.  Rushmore is a diploma mill.  Do your homework before throwing $$ away.

From what I understand, this "university" is a one-man or two-man shop that offers low level self study courses, but labels them as MBA or PHD to market them.  They in no way compare to a real degree.

The accredited Bolton University in the UK is offering online research degrees (MPhil/PhD) in Management alongside its on campus courses.  

Like Rushmore there are also no exams.  According to their website:"The award of a UK Doctorate is based solely upon individual research, presented in the form of a thesis."  There is no attendance but it is encouraged, which is okay with me as I live 10 miles away. Their web page is here tinyurl.com/38gu7pb

The course last between 2-4 years for the MPhil and 4-6 years for the PhD.  They do not list the price but using the University of Portsmouth as a guide, who are also in the UK and has a selection of distance online postgrad degrees, it will be cheaper than Rushmore at around $5000

So why choose Rushmore when there are perfectly legit universities offering the same no exam, no attendance, research/writing approach who are also cheaper or about the same price?

I wonder where I'll be getting my postgrad. degree???

Well they have said they are having to make changes to meet the requirements of accreditation.  One change they should make is to move away from the MBA (which is overrated and just a way for universities to charge more).

Instead they should class all their studies as M.Phil.  In the UK, as elsewhere in Europe, MPhils do not require examinations.  It is like a mini PhD and is sometimes awarded to PhD students who don't make the grade or where the subject is too narrow for a doctorate but deserves researching.

MPhils are awarded after carrying out research, publishing several papers in respected journals on that research and writing a final disertation followed by an oral defense.

In this respect Rushmore is already following the teaching style for an MPhil but perhaps needs to up the rigour, ie referrence reliable academic sources, rather than their preference for pop-management books, carry out worthwhile original research etc.

This way, as a provider of research qualifications they may be able to carve a unique niche for themselves, and attain accreditation.  The Liverpool University for example offer a fully accredited 100% online MBA with no exams following this route.  I think they call it an MBA so they can charge GB£13,500 whereas an MPhil would be just a few thoushand.

What accrediting agency have they applied to?

Diploma mills are always "seeking" accreditation but a simple review of accredication applicants shows they never even applied.

Accreditation process is to be finalised during 2010.  Certain changes/improvements to Rushmore will be made this year in line with assessors suggestions.

Just in case you missed it above:

Some small reminders from the reviews:

"Unusable for employment, higher ed employment and just about everything else. Rushmore is an unaccredited organization operating out of the Cayman Islands."

"Not recommended if you plan on using the degree in the workforce. Not recognized anywhere!!!"

"It is a diploma mill. Not only will you be involved with a fraud but any future employers will judge you on this very negatively. I promise"

"Withdrew after discovering it was a degree mill"

"Having no experience with online, I wasn't sure what to expect. Finally after my second class, I started to get suspicious and did some independent research to find that it was completely unaccredited in the US and largely considered a fraud."

"I did learn some interesting things reading the texts, but it won't contribute towards meaningful progress to any type of valid credential."

"Buyer beware!"

Illegal in the US, specifically listed as a diploma mill.  The British authorities are on the same page.  They can claim to be seeking some legitimacy, but I am sure that is just a marketing ploy.

@??  Rushmore is registered in the British Virgin Islands which is a Brtish Overseas Territory.  These islands are administered by the UK and are seperate from the US Virgin Islands.

What puzzles me with the above comments is how everyone is talking about US accrediation.  Rushmore is a British institute currently seeking accreditation from a British provider.

So what does a diploma mill like Rushmore have to do with a UK school?

This may interest some.  A similar approach to Rushmore's has been adopted by a UK school where students are assessed by written work rather than exams.

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/8401133.stm

xxx.rushmore.edu/Default.aspx?tabid=78

If you can't figure out what a shameless diploma mill this is in less than 5 minutes, you should have your internet connection and high school diploma (if applicable) revoked.

Some small reminders from the reviews:

"Unusable for employment, higher ed employment and just about everything else. Rushmore is an unaccredited organization operating out of the Cayman Islands."

"Not recommended if you plan on using the degree in the workforce. Not recognized anywhere!!!"

"It is a diploma mill. Not only will you be involved with a fraud but any future employers will judge you on this very negatively. I promise"

"Withdrew after discovering it was a degree mill"

"Having no experience with online, I wasn't sure what to expect. Finally after my second class, I started to get suspicious and did some independent research to find that it was completely unaccredited in the US and largely considered a fraud."

"I did learn some interesting things reading the texts, but it won't contribute towards meaningful progress to any type of valid credential."

"Buyer beware!"

"interestedx4 September 18, 2009 at 11:36 a.m.

Not necessarily. Many universities have both accredited and non-accredited courses."

I guess there will always be a market for diploma mills for those who do not understand the basics of higher ed.

If anyone is actually ill-informed enough to think about falling for this diploma mill scan, just indicate your major and people are more than willing to point you to a real university that offers online courses as an alternative, there are many, many out there.

For all of you who are for RushmoreI suggest not to argue with the against rushmore crowd.  Why?,  well look at the americans how they react to fixing their Health system!!! that should tell you all.  They are as ignorant as they where back in the middle ages.  And you actually listen to them on this Blog.  I wouldn't they believe that the President of the USA has death panels!!! he is the Anti-Christ, God what a bunch idiots, they are in favor of the corporations making billions off these suckers,and these suckers support being charged up the ying yang.  He!He!He! typical, look at their town meetings, you would think you were back in the 1700's these old farts yelling supporting the insurance companies, and half don't even have insurance they like paying more.  Most Americans are just plain IGNORANT religious fanatics, a joke that's what they are.  Don't waste your time with them.

Not necessarily.  Many universities have both accredited and non-accredited courses.

So some courses offered through a bogus university are okay, but others are not???? Now you are just being silly.

I would agree with "yes" but if they do begin offering courses by the CMI with CMI's full backing then none of us will be able to question those who have completed their CMI qualification with Rushmore. 

This will then pose a problem for HR departments.  They cannot ignore the CMI qualification and if that was taken at Rushmore, they have to recognise Rushmore as a supplier of recognised professional qualifications.

Obviously a Rushmore MBA is still questionable but not the CMI qualification offered through Rushmore.

True, there are some legitimate online approaches to education, however Rushmore is certainly not one of them.

The British Government views qualifications from chartered organisations as equivalent to a university Masters degree.  Other chartered oranisations besides CMI offering qualifications include the Chartered Institute of Management Accounting and the Chartered Quality Institute.

Non of these organisations however are educational institutes but rather rely on teaching organisations (colleges, universities, online providers) to promote and carry out the teaching of their curriculum.  

For example, you can become a recognised and qualified chartered accountant by studying with an online external body such as RDI (www.rdi.co.uk) without ever stepping foot in a university.

This appears to be the route Rushmore is taking which is perfectly legal.  Obviously its own awards may be called into question, but its degrees from recognised professional institutes, if they get accreditation, can not.

Some small reminders from the reviews:

"Unusable for employment, higher ed employment and just about everything else. Rushmore is an unaccredited organization operating out of the Cayman Islands."

"Not recommended if you plan on using the degree in the workforce. Not recognized anywhere!!!"

"It is a diploma mill. Not only will you be involved with a fraud but any future employers will judge you on this very negatively. I promise"

"Withdrew after discovering it was a degree mill"

"Having no experience with online, I wasn't sure what to expect. Finally after my second class, I started to get suspicious and did some independent research to find that it was completely unaccredited in the US and largely considered a fraud."

"I did learn some interesting things reading the texts, but it won't contribute towards meaningful progress to any type of valid credential."

"Buyer beware!"

Well according to their latest news letter they are looking for accreditation from the CMI (Britain's Chartered Management Institute) to offer their internationally recognised courses through Rushmore.

It looks like their business model will be designed around offering recognised qualifications from respected external bodies and their own in-house nonaccredited qualifications.

I feel sorry for those duped by this "university".  Who in the world doesn't do a basic background check for this type of preventable academic fraud?

Quote Professor Simon J Singh, PhD, EdD, MBA, MSc :"And it is often true that the high flying "cream of the crop" of the business world that will attend MBA programs from prestigious institutions - the tuition often reflects the financial abilities of its students as well. Therefore, what kind of networking would you come to expect if you were to enroll in a Rushmore degree? Remember the idiom "birds of the same feather flocks together"
Well if a Harvard MBA is about 74thousand USD and together with your last comment one would tend to understand that your belief is: "you want to study at Harvard? you d better be of "our" race...."
-none the less with current crisis it turned out that many middle prestige MBA awarded geniuses of middle class put forward great ideas to save the world and companies from certain disaster, because of "high class flock" scams getting rich by non-legit operations. I d say if you need pioneering people to give solutions and clean up your mess, you’d better have some respect... well done on your degrees by the way... and I a mid 30s ignorant with just a BA and MA degrees just made up 5 million USD for my company in six months and partially saved the day....(a 5% growth in the second trimester in plain crisis is not bad at all) well not that they would pay my MBA in Harvard though... who knows maybe i would fit in with the "flock" and with some funding I would make a great competitor if I went out on my own....
Bottom line: I need people who have initiative and drive, who can put decisions to work and have results. I test my subordinates on the job and believe you me Harvard MBA holder would cost me more money and many times would look at his/her degree shrine in order to be effective and less prone to real teamwork due to arrogance...this is also a type of common feather in some flocks of high prestige universities!

best regards

Let's Review some of the worrisome remarks:

March 1, 2009
“It is a diploma mill. Not only will you be involved with a fraud but any future employers will judge you on this very negatively. I promise.”

January 23, 2009
“However, be advised that if you want some government jobs that require degrees from regionally accredited institutions, or you wish to teach at a traditional school they will not recognize this degree.”

June 10, 2008
“Great set up. Not recommended if you plan on using the degree in the workforce. Not recognized anywhere!!!”

December 26, 2007
“Unusable for employment, higher ed employment and just about everything else. Rushmore is an unaccredited organization operating out of the Cayman Islands.”

October 21, 2006
“I started to get suspicious and did some independent research to find that it was completely unaccredited in the US and largely considered a fraud. As far as European use, they list a European accrediting agency, but I have been unable to verify that that accrediting agency means anything or if it really exists for any other purpose than a phony plug for Rushmore and others like it. I did learn some interesting things reading the texts, but it won’t contribute towards meaningful progress to any type of valid credential.”

August 14, 2006
“I did this for personal reasons and cannot attest to the value compared to industry standards as in academia.”

In your opibion, I guess they are all not telling the truth, right?

Bill Gates is a one in a million exception to the rule. Get real! Don't waste your time and money with this 'university'. Go to an accredited university which will vastly improve your chances in your chosen career.

Hi guys I have read your posts and found really amazing! Do you wate you precious time fighting your own internal education demons? Just have a question. Do you rather be in a university to attend classes or you would prefer doing research? You know that the point I think you all should think about. If doing research grants you a degree and research experience I think that is ok. If you prefer to sit your butt in a university chair to listen some guy who has never managed a business or created a solution to a problem, that is ok also. In fact that is the demon you have to fight if you are to be competent, knowlegeable and business savvy. By the way, do not forget the fact the Bill Gates did not finish university. Do you know why? He did not want to listen an idiot who could not explain him how to be a billionary! Nonetheless Bill Gates deserves a degree in Engineering and entrepreneurship don´t you agreee with me?   "To be or not to be" is the question! If it works wow! if not caput and burn your accredited diploma.Cheers for all and take care of your demons!

This so-called "university" is a fricken joke. I feel sorry for the suckers who fell for this mill.

"I don't think there is enough evidence to even verify that it is a "university" of any type. Online, located supposedly in the Caymans, never been reviewed by any outside party...

It looks like someone with a little web design ability and a credit card machine, nothing more."

You got that right!

"I have no problem with people using unaccredited "universities" for their personal needs."

I don't think there is enough evidence to even verify that it is a "university" of any type.  Online, located supposedly in the Caymans, never been reviewed by any outside party...

It looks like someone with a little web design ability and a credit card machine, nothing more.

You are nothing more than a propagandist for Rushmore. Because of people like you, the first world has to deal with this garbage coming out of the third world. Here is the truth from people who have graduated or are current students of Rushmore "university":

"Unusable for employment, higher ed employment and just about everything else.  Rushmore is an unaccredited organization operating out of the Cayman Islands."

"Not recommended if you plan on using the degree in the workforce. Not recognized anywhere!!!"

"It is a diploma mill. Not only will you be involved with a fraud but any future employers will judge you on this very negatively. I promise"

"Withdrew after discovering it was a degree mill"

"Having no experience with online, I wasn't sure what to expect.  Finally after my second class, I started to get suspicious and did some independent research to find that it was completely unaccredited in the US and largely considered a fraud."

"I did learn some interesting things reading the texts, but it won't contribute towards meaningful progress to any type of valid credential."

"Buyer beware!"

The "school" has a 5.82 rating; one of the worst on this site! I am also sick and tired of hearing this crap from you about "CHEA not being a guarantee of a quality education" etc. Universities that are CHEA approved are the best in the world (i.e. Harvard, Yale, Stanford etc.)Unaccredited equals lack of quality and standards. That is really the truth! A place like Rushmore "university" cannot meet any standard in the first world; CHEA or otherwise!That is why the "degrees" from Rushmore are NOT ACCEPTED in the U.S. and Western Europe!

the truth is that CHEA accreditation does not guarantee neither the quality of education provided nor that the graduate will get employed! Moreover, regional accreditation requires schools to follow a specific curriculum, full of useless, general courses, which have nothing to do with the area of study the student has chosen! Furthemore, as long as regional accreditation is optional (not mandatory), one can understand that a University is free to choose what curriculum will follow and what type of accreditation will hold so that it can serve its strategic mission.

You said:
"Rushmore University is a very good school that chooses to remain unaccredited, because they consider their method of study, courses, textbooks, and general educational approach to be superior to the traditional learning methods applied by regionally accredited schools."

No. They don't choose to remain unaccredited. They would NEVER get accredited by CHEA or any one else in the U.S. or Western Europe. They are a joke. That is the truth!

An educational institution can provide great education while being unaccredited (this line of thought is expressed by the US Dept of Education in their website regarding accreditation). 

Rushmore University is a very good school that chooses to remain unaccredited, because they consider their method of study, courses, textbooks, and general educational approach to be superior to the traditional learning methods applied by regionally accredited schools.

I have no problem with people using unaccredited "universities" for their personal needs. I have a problem with them trying to use the sub-par "degrees" in a professional setting.

I do not live in Virgin Islands (of course) and
secondly I do not hold a degree from Rushmore University
myself. I hold a BA in Business Administration from a regionally accredited American University! Though, I believe
that some people may find that unaccredited education just fulfills their personal/professional needs (eg they do not need a recognized degree to get an occupational license etc); therefore there is no reason to be so negative...!

Please read very carefully what individuals that have actually taken the classes have written above. That alone would stir me clear of this place. As I have said before, there are thousands of accredited universities where a person can learn and get a degree. I would like to know exactly why individuals would choose Rushmore. I haven't found a good reason yet. In addition, the fact that these former and current students rate the school with a 5.82 is also very telling. 
Another point: I am not the only individual that considers accreditation to be important. The entire first world considers it important!

Some people choose to follow a non-accredited program for whatever reasons they have; just respect their right to have choice; you cannot impose, dictate, command students what to do just because you consider accreditation something that matters..!

This comment is for "come on..." (aka because....)
You of course did not have a direct answer to the original statement:

Name any accredited university in the U.S. that recognizes and accepts Rushmore "degrees".

You have no real response because that trash dump of a "university" issues degrees that no accreditied university will accept or recognize.

There are plenty of online degree programs from accreditied universities you can participate in because they are interesting, they have a great curriculum, great teachers-faculty, great books to read, and great things to learn.
Why attend this trash?

Why in the world would a person waste their time and money on such a "university"?

Because it is interesting, it's got a great curriculum, great teachers-faculty, great books to read, great things to learn ... that's why!

Let's Review some of the worrisome remarks:


March 1, 2009
“It is a diploma mill. Not only will you be involved with a fraud but any future employers will judge you on this very negatively. I promise.”

January 23, 2009
“However, be advised that if you want some government jobs that require degrees from regionally accredited institutions, or you wish to teach at a traditional school they will not recognize this degree.”

June 10, 2008
“Great set up. Not recommended if you plan on using the degree in the workforce. Not recognized anywhere!!!”

December 26, 2007
“Unusable for employment, higher ed employment and just about everything else. Rushmore is an unaccredited organization operating out of the Cayman Islands.”


October 21, 2006
“I started to get suspicious and did some independent research to find that it was completely unaccredited in the US and largely considered a fraud. As far as European use, they list a European accrediting agency, but I have been unable to verify that that accrediting agency means anything or if it really exists for any other purpose than a phony plug for Rushmore and others like it. I did learn some interesting things reading the texts, but it won’t contribute towards meaningful progress to any type of valid credential.”


August 14, 2006
“I did this for personal reasons and cannot attest to the value compared to industry standards as in academia.”

Are there some good remarks made in the reviews? Yes; of course there were. However, these remarks above should at the very least worry you greatly. This school's average is 5.82; one of the worst listed on this site. It is not accredited in the U.S. Therefore, people should ask themselves "why"? Why in the world would a person waste their time and money on such a "university"?

Rushmore, Rochville, Almeda, St. Regis, whatever, just slap it on your resume and call yourself "Doctor", nobody cares.

I understand that within your "microcosmos" (the academia, etc.) maybe that the issue of accreditation is a popular discussion theme, although if you step out of your office and walk around in the real world you'll discover that nobody cares about the type of the accreditation a university holds...!

Name any accredited university in the U.S. that recognizes and accepts Rushmore "degrees".

Visit rushmore website to see who its students/graduates/faculty are. They are
all accomplished professionals, successful
in their field...!

I agree with you completely! I have never heard or read of a Rushmore degree being accepted by any company or recognized by any university. I noticed that "selective perception" did not answer your question. You just can't get a straight answer out of those guys, can you?

You've never heard of that, because you hear whatever fits your arguments...! (this is called selective perception)

What company is that?  I've never heard of it being accepted anywhere, even where legal.

Rushmore is perfectly legal in my state and perfectly accepted in my company!

I'll let the above poster respond too, but Rushmore is specifically listed as being illegal in my state, and it's not valid for employment in my company (or any in the industry that I know of).

Why is Rushmore fake? because you don't like the fact
that it is not accredited by an official accreditor?

There are many.  

If you want a more recognized online program, try Louisiana State, very inexpensive.

If you are looking for a real, accredited, low cost, small school, try Chadron State (NE) or Fort Hayes State.

For any students here are considering going the diploma mill route due to cost, post your intended field of study and I am sure someone can point you to an alternative.

"For the same price ....you can EARN a recognized, online accredited degree". Suggestions? Any accredited on-line colleges recommended at the same price?
Because, If you have no suggestions, your remarks are useless...!

I agree that distance learning is a great avenue for people to complete their education.  However diploma mills like Rushmore only give online education a bad rap.

For the same price as buying this crap, you can EARN a recognized, online accredited degree.

Since accreditation is the quality standard in the US, there is no such thing as self-accreditation or self-approval or whatever they are trying to sell to the naive.

No matter what you say, on-line education is the future and Rushmore is the leader in distance learning studies...! Accreditation can be perfectly private/independent; smart people and mature students (who are working adults and accomplished professionals) do not need "others" to accredit the education they are receiving; they are in position to judge themselves the progress they are making towards enhanced knowlegde, a better career, a more meaningful life.

Listing fake universities in a long list of real universities is a very common diploma mill tactic and there presence here only advances the myth that they are a real university.

I also vote to have them removed.

I will ask the administrator why in the world they have this unaccredited "university" listed on this site. They are not recognized by CHEA and no one will accept the degree for employment that I know of. To list them here is silly.

"tennis courses will be offered as a promo"

Funny you mention that, since tennis is one of the many activities that Rushmore will grant you significant "life experience" credits for.

But you missed the point, since it is more applicable to  real, accredited programs that offer online MBA's, which may get you the degree, but you miss out on a lot of the benefits of a cohort model.

Rushmore provides neither a valid credential nor networking opportunities.

Dear Professor Simon J Singh,
you are confusing education with social clubs!
I thought that education implies knowledge, research etc.
Now, we learn from your lips that it is somewhat 
equivalent to social networking like. Why do not you
set up a social club instead of teaching? (I suggest
the name "Mba vips'social club"; free tennis courses will
be offered as a promo...).

Well said!

From my perspective as an academic, if a potential candidate comes to me either for entry as a student or teaching staff, I would question his choice of doing a degree from an unaccredited institution.

For entry as a student, I would point right out that their degree will not be considered for any recognition of prior learning whatsoever. However, we will consider his prior professional experience for EMBAs and other non-rushmore academic qualifications.

For entry as an academic, I would point right our that their degree is no recognized and question up front their knowledge or lack thereof about accreditation and academic integrity. Up to 90% of the time I would reject applications who submit resumes with unaccredited institutional qualifications. The remaining 10% are earmarked for a 2nd round of screening simply because they may also possess other forms of accredited qualifications.

Frankly, I'm quite amused with the whole concept of a Rushmore MBA. Yes, the title of MBA grants a certain level of prestige which is valuable economically in a business sense. However, the majority of the benefits lies in the program;s inherent networking opportunities. Most students  spoke to said they felt that the most valuable experience they got from their MBA were from the opportunities they had to interact and build up rapport and friendship among their cohort, which proves to be quite valuable to them when they do business / job switch in the future. 

And it is often true that the high flying "cream of the crop" of the business world that will attend MBA programs from prestigious institutions - the tuition often reflects the financial abilities of its students as well. Therefore, what kind of networking would you come to expect if you were to enroll in a Rushmore degree? Remember the idiom  "birds of the same feather flocks together!"




Professor Simon J Singh
PhD (Hull), EdD (GWU), MBA (Hull), MSc (UNSW)

"However, be advised that if you want some government jobs that require degrees from regionally acredited institutions, or you wish to teach at a traditional school they will not recongnize this degree.  That said, I do consulting and having a PhD helps with credibility in conjuction with experience of course, and ultimately no on really cares where you got your degree from."

Wow, it would be gross negligence to hire a consultant with false credentials without proper due diligence.

A fake PhD would absolutely kill any credibility.  A competent MBA with quality experience would greatly trump someone claiming a Rushmore "PhD" since such a claim would immediately call everything into question.

"no on really cares where you got your degree from."

Hahahahahaha.  If that was 1% true, I would whip out my credit card and get a Rushmore "PhD" this instant.

"It looks good, not your usual dip.mil web page"

I would call it a "sophisticated" diploma mill. The kind that requires just a little bit of work to get buy-in from the degree purchasers, but nothing resembling a real university.

It's free marketing to claim you are seeking accreditation, especially when you don't disclose the body you are supposedly seeking it from.  

In the past, Rushmore has claimed approval from a variety of agencies, none of them recognized.

Rushmore has a mail drop address in the Cayman Islands, having been located in South Dakota, Wyoming and Georgia so far.

Hmmmm,

I've spent some time looking at their website.  It looks good, not your usual dip.mil web page (ie: get your diploma in seven days!).

I also read their latest newsletter.  This is the confusing bit.  They do state as mentioned above that they are seeking accreditation from an established body in the UK (how "Liar" can know that no record exists of them is strange unless he was referring to himself when choosing an alias) but their website seems to deride accreditation.  Are the for it or against?  

Of course I also know that there has been a change of management at Rushmore so maybe the wedsite still reflects the views of it's founder and not those of the newly appointed heads.

It will be interesting to watch, especially if they are going for genuine accreditation and if they are awarded it (and many other virtual universities have) it will be interesting to read what many of the commentators here have to say.

Let's face it, other virtual universities have become legally accredited and if, under this new management, they make the changes and meet the standards required, whose to say they won't.

Don't buy the claims of accreditation attempts, they are quoted directly from a diploma mills website.

No UK body has any record of attempts at accreditation.

Also, that body is also unnamed, to nobody's surprise.

There are dozens, if not hundreds of legitimiate, accredited, virtual universities out there.

"$9,899 for a worthless degree"

econopinion.blogspot.com/2005/06/9899-tuition-for-worthless-degree.html

One of the advantages of being a student at Rushmore is that there are no tests to take. The curriculum consists of reading a series of books, most of which I read when I was 13 or 14 years old, and writing a short book report on each. Dale Carnegie's How to Win Friends and Influence People is one example of a book that some Rushmore students have read in fulfillment of a course requirement.

Your right Rushmore is unaccredited just like every other university was when they first began.

However news just in... Rushmore is working towards accreditation with a UK based Higher Educational accreditation body with the "initial work completed."

"Currently, each course offered through any of the Rushmore MA/MBA PhD/DBA Programs is being assessed for inclusion within the various accrediting templates.   This represents over 300 different courses.
 
“The process of course assessment and inclusion will require the balance of 2008, and the Documentation Phase will be able to begin shortly after the start of the New Year,” said Alan Guinn, Dean of Graduate Studies.  “During 2009, we anticipate additional studies and assessments to be conducted.”  

The preparation for the Accrediting Process is being spearheaded by Dean Alan Guinn, with assistance from Dr. Geoff Winter, Dr. Al Hennon, and a host of Rushmore Faculty and Staff. 

Accrediting a fully virtual University is a difficult process and has only been successfully accomplished one time previously---where the University had ties to a specific Government, which mandated it be accredited."


So give them time for god's sake.

Well, if any unaccredited degree will do, I recommend Rochville University, $299, get your degree in 5-7 business days.

bottom line scam

I think that a school that so many think highly of would atleast get DETC at thhe very least in order to get accepted here in the USA as creditable. But from what i seen on thier website thier studies is based on essays so therefore it is not acceptable in educational teachings that would allow them to become RA and or NA. 

However in other countries is a diffrent story as long as that person that hold thr degree is job worthy it's fine so it is a good degree pursute for those in other countries.

But here in the USA where everything is a beuracrecy and self imposed ego trip RUSHMORE CAUSES A TREAT. So if the other colleges and universites feel thaT THEY ARE SERVING THE BEST IN EDUCATION THEN A SCHOOL LIKE RUSHMORE SO NOT BE A  TREAT.

Now if that university works for you then by all mesns go for it.

Some points are being missed here:

1) The purpose of accreditation is to ensure that the courses taught at an institution is benchmarked against an industry accepted set of standards.

2) Per point one, accreditation renders credits earned at other institutions recognized and acceptable at other institutions.

3) Most foreign governments and organizations recognizes a qualification based on the concept of "self recognition". If its fully recognized by the local government where the institution is located, then, under general circumstances, they would recognize it too.

4) If your qualification does not afford you credit exemptions from other accredited institutions, what's its value? Unless you are not looking for professional certification, an academic position, or an option to further your qualification with advanced studies at other  accredited institutions. then go ahead and attend Rushmore or KWU.

How's that for an objective observation - the most priced quality of an academic research.

These degrees are Novelty items and nothing more.  Don't waste your money.

SCAM. RUN SCAM DON'T RISK YOU REPUTATION.

Take your money and set it on fire, it will have a higher Return on Investment than this so-called "university".

Just forget it!

If you are considering a Rushmore "degree", print one off on your home computer, it will be cheaper and have the same level of recognition.

Instead of wasting your money on this unrecognized degree that will hinder your career, there are hundreds of good distance education programs out there.

You can select from a low-cost regionally accredited degree such as Fort Hays State or Peru State, if you are not concerned about the name.  Both are under $150 per credit, and down to $110 if you are in state.

Or you can go with a recognized school with an online option, such as the University of Illinois, or Penn State at more cost.

Unless the sole purpose of your degree is to hang it in the basement and show it to your cat, or just for personal development, go for it, otherwise get a real college degree if you want to use it for employment.

Yeah... Buyer beware. If you can afford it, go for it and send your 45 grand or so to Walden or Phoenix U online, they're probably great. I am going through with my Rushmore U degree, because I have not only directly worked with some very accomplished people teaching within that framework, but have also used the learning in my daily life. If that is not worthwhile, I don't know what is. I recommend that you do the homework, really look at what your expectations are and then go for it; too right, if I had the money and time I would try to enroll at Harvard or one of those recognized places of learning... Question is though: Are they value for money? Are those guys better than I am in any way? I think not. If you have a different opinion, please share.

This is the 21st century, a routine HR background check will disover this in 2 seconds.

Rushmore "University" also says:

"Our programs are based on written papers. You tailor your own curriculum with the guidance of our renowned Professors. There are no exams or required courses"

You get the picture, just what you would expect from an unaccredited, offshore, for-profit company that grants unrecognized paper.

Actually from their hokey website, saying that they use the "Oxford teaching method" and...

'Founded in 1096 in Oxford, England, Oxford University is the oldest English-speaking university in the world. Over the nine centuries since then, Oxford has graduated five kings, 40 Nobel Prize winners, 25 British Prime Ministers, nine current holders of the Order of Merit, three Saints, 18 Cardinals and 85 Archbishops.

The Tutorial Method has been used at Oxford for more than 500 years."

Let me try it.

Here at Pseudoreal University, we use books, just like Harvard does.  Harvard has graduated 8 presidents!!!!

"I would have loved to study under Philip Crosby, the international guru in QA who also taught with Rushmore."

His books are used in the course, but I doubt he did any "teaching" in an unaccredited online Caymans "university".

"Anyway the point is that it is possible to do a quality degree by distance learning so why bother wasting your money on a joke like Rushmore?"

I agree, there are dozens of legitimate options out there for any conceivable type of degree.  For whatever reason, there seems to be a market for people who want to take a short cut to an unusable credential.

I agree with you, its just a shame I didn't know of Rushmore a few years ago.  I come from a QA background (with accreditted professional qualifications), and I would have loved to study under Philip Crosby, the international guru in QA who also taught with Rushmore.  Sadly he died a couple of years back.

However the others look equally impressive in their credentials and I think there would be a lot to learn from their experience and knowledge.

Hi! I am enrolled at Rushmore university, shelled out about 5.5 grand about 4 years ago for part of a DBA program with them, but haven't done the work yet.

In the meantime I went out and just for the fun of it, bought the same degree off the net for about 300 bucks, but from the "university" of Aberdeen international. To be fair to them, they do require you to do a general knowledge quiz which was great fun to do and at times quite challenging (and i did spend a lot of time "researching" the answers off the net). Just before I forget what my point was, I was going to use that as motivation, however my aberdeen "dba" is safely locked in my desk at home, as it is not really worth the paper it is written on even as a novelty item, since it looks too fake even to be a fake, but after reading a lot of the above I wonder if an eventual Rushmore degree would be treated the same way when I get it?

Mind you, they DO require you to work and some of the people involved there are highly accomplished professionals, with some of the best publications in their fields. An example of that is Tom Lambert, who has had some fine books on consulting.

As well, you cannot get a grade from them without at least a good 40 hours of work, in any of the courses done. All you get for something like that is about 2 credits, which is equivalent to the work done in some of the best universities.

Having said all that, do I consider them a diploma mill? No! Do I recommend it to others? yes, but keeping in mind that unaccredited is a bad word to have to attach to your degree description on your CV. I probably will never mention it there, but  there is merit in going trough the reading and discussions with their great people. 

To me, that is education, and for that I believe their cost is actually really low.

Interesting chat.
European Council for Business Education mentioned above looks like it is based in someones bedroom. I did my MBA with the UK's Open University. It is fully accredited UK University (UK's largest and one of the best), AMBA EQUIS (these are the serious accreditation agencies for MBA's in Europe) as well as the US AACSB- I am sure you folks in the US have heard of that. Anyway the point is that it is possible to do a quality degree by distance learning so why bother wasting your money on a joke like Rushmore?

1.  "there would appear to be a separate agenda afoot."

The agenda is to verify that applicants are qualified and have a valid degree, not a Cayman Island mystery program of unknown content or value.

2.  "Employers want employees who really know what they need to know" 

Well, common sense and ability to research before making a poor decision on your education would be one skill.

3.  "I would suggest to the reader, that it is purely a personal choice if you chose Rushmore." 

I agree.  Call yourself "Dr." to your cat if you feel like it, but certainly don't try and pass it off to an employer.

4.  "I have never experienced an employer who has scoffed at my Rushmore accreditation" 

Well, any minimally trained HR staff should identify it immediately with a $6 background check.  It’s a point of emphasis for SHRM, the HR professional group.

5.  "and can I say they are BIG multinational companies."

Notice these are always nameless companies that supposedly encourage and support dubious universities?

6.  "Please keep one thing in mind, accreditation is an option taken up by an institution."

From US Gov
Frequently Asked Questions about diploma mills, fraudulent degrees, and accreditation. Among other things:

Accreditation is “voluntary,” so doesn't that mean it is optional and not necessary?

Since accreditation is the PRIMARY means of determining the legitimacy and quality of colleges and universities in the United States, to describe the process as "voluntary" is not to describe it as "optional" or "unnecessary."

7.  “there should be more Universities like them”

There are many.  Almeda, Belford, Kennedy-Western, Rochville, etc…

Friends- I am intrigued by this debate because my cousin is presently enrolled with Rushmore studying for a second master's degree. She has been with them for about a year now. She is retired and was looking to earn another degree for personal satisfaction more than anything else. Doing all of it online is a huge plus for her as she lives in a remote area.

She considered a number of online universities before choosing Rushmore, including some big ones such as Phoenix and Capella. She chose Rushmore because of the system of study they offer, in which a big premium is put on writing, and because their tuition is considerably less than the others. She is aware of their lack of accreditation and knows she could never use the degree for a job or to transfer to another university.

That being said, she really enjoys her experience. She loves the very personal interaction with her professors who she says are as challenging as any she has ever had. The self paced model of study is a big plus also. The whole program is remarkably low priced compared to some online institutions- about 25% of the cost of the same program at Strayer University.

This is just my cousin's experience, and you can take it however you like. Rushmore is unaccredited, but to be fair there are many accredited institutions whose degrees are just as useless. I won't name them, but look at the reviews on this website and you will quickly figure out who they are. People who hold these degrees often cannot get jobs or transfer credits either. These organizations also have poor reputations for student support. Probably worst of all, it could be said that some of them did only the minimum required to get accreditation so they could get on the student loan/GI bill gravy train.

From what I have seen, Rushmore's program can be of value to some people as long as they are fully aware of its limitations. Rushmore would not be my first choice, but it would not be my last either. You could spend alot more money with a minimally accredited (DETC only) institution and have a much worse experience. Peace, John.

AC,

The bottom line is that Rushmore is on the US Department of Education's "black list." The degree is currently not accepted in over 25 states (at least not legally), and that number is growing. Whether you agree with Rushmore's educational approach or not it doesnt matter. Just dont seek employment here. Unfortunately for you the game will soon be over...

For those who have read all the comments above, you can see there is a wide divide between those for and those against Rushmore. There are those who vigorously chose to denegrate the institution without any evidence of knowledge as to how the teaching process is undertaken at Rushmore, and those who have attended the university.

It would appear with the verbosity and animosity of those who attack Rushmore, there would appear to be a separate agenda afoot. Is it because Rushmore threatens their own stamping grounds??? Are they from rival institutions jealous and threatened by Rushmore’s' innovative teaching philosophy.

Like anything else - Rushmore has stood the test of time, with enrolments growing. I wonder why - is everyone in the world a mug as the critics would reply - or are people interested in getting a real education?

Employers want employees who really know what they need to know to get a job done, not theories, and impractical and outdated philosophies. How many books are written from practical perspectives that are currently being used in 'accredited' institutions - very few I would suspect. In all my MBA courses at a top 'accredited' University, not one was written by person/persons who had actually worked in the real world. In fact, several I had to study were written by the professorial staff teaching the subject matter.

I would suggest to the reader, that it is purely a personal choice if you chose Rushmore. As I have written before, you can only grow in yourself and gain in-depth knowledge from highly accredited teaching staff who have been there and done it themselves. It is up to you.

I have never experienced an employer who has scoffed at my Rushmore accreditation or my degrees from 'accredited universities'. The point in fact, is that the Rushmore degree has been highly prized by some who have opted to pay for other personal to attend the University as a major benefit to the company. These employers have a knowledge and understanding of how Rushmore works and the quality of education that it provides to its students, and the ultimate benefit to there own company, and can I say they are BIG multinational companies.

Please keep one thing in mind, accreditation is an option taken up by an institution. Similar to unionism in the workplace. If Rushmore wishes to stand alone, and not be connected with a program of accreditation that seems to embrace every style of institution in the USA ( from very poor educators, to ivy league) under one banner – then so be it. It is Rushmore’s choice, and the fact that they are located in the Cayman Islands allows them that freedom of choice.  They offer unbiased education to the world, and there should be more Universities like them.

For those of you looking for a legitimate Doctorate in Business, avoid the Almedas, Rushmores, Kennedy-Western "universities".  I'll stop back with some real university options.

Can't guarantee what the price will be, because part of the unaccredited "life experience" business model is to waive a large amount of credits.  

Back soon!

I am so tired of this debate, to all thoes who say that Rushmore is a fake, tell where to look for a Doctoral degree in business that I can do online, not living in the US and at a resonable price?

By definition Rushmore isn't a diploma mill.  A diploma mill is, in its simplest terms, a person sat next to a computer who simply prints out diploma's as the orders come in, hence the name (mill being another name for a factory).  Today many of these outfits are very sophisticated but always driven by the pursuit of profit for that company.

Rushmore began when a group of businessmen,  some with ivy league doctorates, decided that traditional business education was failing and so began teaching it themselves.  No one owns Rushmore, its not a company, and its a non-profit organisation.  The facutly don't depend on Rushmore for their income, they are successful businessmen in their own rights, they just want to help others benefit from their experience and knowledge in a very practical way.

Plus students do learn a lot as the research requirements for a paper can be high, but maybe that's dependent on the adviser.  All in all whether or not this degree is accredited, students do learn and acquire a knowledge that can help them in their careers.  Also they develop a network of some influential and respected CEOs, authors and educators, who become friends as well as mentors.

Diploma - Mill

People try to pass this off on employers? Really?

I've looked very deeply into the subject and Rushmore is not "something new", it's just another unaccredited university trying to pass itself off as legitimate.  Why?  Money.  Very little effort goes into each student, and it can be a cash cow.

"study with the best" is a laughable statement.  "Successful salesmen" might fit.

Convincing "students" that accreditation is unimportant and that "our system of learning" is better is the typical M.O. of what has been called a "Sophisticated Diploma mill" during investigations of similiar schools.

To LOL at rationalizing, and Wrong - you really both need to learn about this institution, not shoot from the hip through ignorance and arrogance. I may be a sucker to you - and you may think Rushmore 'Mickey Mouse' from pure arrogance and ignorance - but I would do it again and have recommended Rushmore to many others who have taken up the opportunity to study with the best who actually know what they are talking about as they have done it in real life. 
Get a grip folks - please have the decency to research the subject matter for yourselves - not just be brainless automatons parroting biased and ill informed crap. Seems there are always the cynics afraid of anything new - AND THAT WORKS in educating people.

Rushmore isn't "enlightened" or "advanced" or "ahead of its' time", it's simply another shady business operating from the Caymans that occassionally convinces people that it's legitimate.

I'm sure if I went to the library, got a bunch of books, and read them, I would learn something about business.  But if I tried to convince a potential employer that it was equivalent to an MBA, well good luck...

Well, kudos to Rushmore for reeling in suckers for their worthless programs.

Shame on crappy HR departments that don't perform a rudimentary background check.

Reading all the above is a ridiculous waste of time. I have worked as a corp consultant with an unaccredited AD degree, trained MBA's,that sat and cried because they could not handle the load, or through their own arrogance could not operate the facility. Their lack of leadership, did nothing but leave patients to lay in their own feces and urine, suffer weight loss, dehydration, and yes, even death while they sat back in their suits, with accredited degrees hanging on their office wall, and clueless to what the US gov requires for quality. I am working on a BHCA, only because my present position requires it, that is not even a corp position. The folks  operating this establishment are having me go and educate their teams because they are non-compliant with the gov rules in operating the business.The real kicker is that my specialty is in LTC, and working with ? professionals in the acute care arena, and educating them on how to do it right, is the most craziest thing. Acute care folks think the LTC professionals know nothing compared to them, yet I had to write a plan of correction for them because the Masters credentialed person did not know how to for state survey.

It is NOT the degree, it is what you do with your experience from the education you received.

Go figure!!!

If you want a real DBA, you'll have to go to an accredited university.

If you want a bogus DBA from Rushmore, try Rochville University, Almeda University, or Belford, it's the same quality and a lot cheaper

I have spent 3 years writing/researching a thesis on a new model of Business English. I have qualifications in engineering, marketing and an MBA and now want a DBA. All the accredited schools I have approached are happy for me to study with them, but of course they all want many thousands of dollars and several years of my life. At 61, I don’t have motivation or time to attend any university. I also have extreme doubts that any professor could add value to my proposed new model - of course a professor could add value to the mechanics of my writing. Based on this information, and based on the fact that my knowledge of business is very high, would Rushmore be beneficial to me or not?

OK - I have swung between amusement and total anger after reading this entire chat page.......people - those who judge from ignorance and lack of knowledge are bigots and idiots. I have studied and graduated from accredited institutions and found the regurgitating of texts to satisfy tenured professorial dogma in examinations on subject matters that have no real relevance to the professional world that I have work in was truly a waste of time. 

Accreditation consists of the measurement of bricks and mortar, assets (library etc), tenured teaching staff, courses and their structures to meet a recognized standards within the accreditation program. Accreditation may be important to those who rely on others telling them something is OK and acceptable – but for those who can think for themselves, Rushmore offers a fantastic opportunity to LEARN and GROW. 

The garbage about ‘illegal use of a Rushmore degree’ in Texas and other states – oh please get a life – After all they jail you for jaywalking in Texas……. If these states in the USA have decided to enact such legislative crap then it just proves the closed minded arrogance and ignorance of those making such decisions – maybe they should have done some research first – ah - but that takes someone with the capability to do so.

Yes I spent 3 years studying at Rushmore – and I am proud of what I have achieved. My advisers were among the very best in the fields who had practiced ‘what they preached’ having not spent their life in the cloistered, hallowed environments of academia. The level of knowledge and personal growth I have obtained from this time of my life has made me both stronger and more proficient in my professional life, to the point where I earn a large 6 figure income and am considered the leading expert in my field in my country – and before the bigots come back – it is NOT a third world country – but a major ally of the USA. My employers all know I am a Rushmore PhD and both acknowledge and accept this degree without hesitation.

So to all those who may think about studying at Rushmore – Go for it – you will not lose and your will learn from the very best. The whole purpose of accreditation and its real value should be the question. If accreditation was based on the quality of education received then Rushmore would be among the best Universities in the world.

As of June 4, 2006 Rushmore had a mailing address in the Cayman Islands.  The Maine Department of Education lists it as having been located in South Dakota, Wyoming, Georgia, and the Cayman Islands.

Rushmore's promotional material claims that the conventionally recognized system of educational accreditation in the United States is irrelevant and that Rushmore has instead attained "independent accreditation," as measured solely by the success of its graduates.  In the past Rushmore had claimed approval from a variety of agencies, none of them recognized

I agree, too bad Rushmore is worthless in any country.

With regards to Texas and ? all I can say is "Thank God I live in a country where ones knowledge, regardless of how it has been acquired, is valued higher than a name."

What other states is it illegal to use a Rushmore degree in?

The state of Texas specifically lists Rushmore under the heading:

"Institutions Whose Degrees are Illegal to Use in Texas"

"Fraudulent or substandard degree" means a degree conferred in Texas in violation of the Texas Education Code; conferred in another state in violation of that state's laws;"

How can the timebomb be ticking when his employers know about Rushmore and that its an unaccredited qualification?

Way to sneak one by them!  That timebomb is ticking...

Tick tick tick

I received my MBA from Rushmore 2 years ago...I work for Time Warner (yes they know its unaccredited) and made 90k last year, eat it!

Never mind, I got it. Thank you all. :)

Rushmore -  can I study psychology there? Do they have professors with PhD in psychology?

Love the review titled "Definately not a Diploma Mill"

That's like saying, my mom is "Definitely not an escort"

http://chronicle.com/colloquylive/2004/06/diploma/

Question from Renea Eshleman:
    Alan, since much in the diploma mill arena is beyond the reach of state authorities, what role should the FTC, USEd, or other federal government entities take? 

Alan Contreras:
    The federal government ought to focus on two areas. First, it should continue the process of making sure that federal employees are all using legitimate degrees. 

Second, it should begin working toward standards to use for evaluating which foreign degrees (or fake foreign degrees such as the fraudulent ones issued by the entity called St. Regis University, which pretends to be from Liberia but actually runs out of Spokane, Washington)should be allowed into the U.S. as credentials. Right now we have things like "Rushmore University" and "Washington International University" pretending to be legitimate colleges but actually operating off little Caribbean islands. We should not have fifty different state laws dealing with foreign degrees. The feds also need to get involved when there is interstate sale of bogus degrees. Right now they generally don't, not since Allen Ezell's FBI operation some years ago.

I recommend many of the other unaccredited universities such as Rochville, Almeda, St. Regis, Belford over Rushmore, since they have more competitive pricing, faster turnaround, and the same academic merit as Rushmore "university"

No, I was referring to unaccredited "universities" such as this one, that naive people take a couple weeks to complete a degree, then defend it endlessly.

That depends Max on which Rushmore you looked at.  There is an organisational calling themselves Rushmore who offer diploma's for money.  Here we are talking about the Rushmore where work and study is required with your tutor/mentor and where assignments have to be completed.  The first, and by all accounts the website you have been to, is definately a dip.mill, it's just not the one being discussed here.

This is also borne out by the fact that Rushmore University is non-profit making.

Vee.....

Let's get this US issue out of the discussion because it is not relevant.  Accreditation is an accepted means of evaluating schools around the world. 


This quote from their website is intentionally misleading to me.



Rushmore University has independent accreditation. Independent accreditation is earned through performance. It is measured by the value that a school delivers, not only to its students, but also to the organizations that employ them and pay their tuition fees.




The reality is that Rushmore's program is validated by "itself".  No independent body scrutinizes their offerings (American or otherwise).  

If accreditation is so bad and their methodology is so superior, why does this school just say they are not accredited period?

I would think that as a potential student this would be a cause of concern.

You all sound like real americans who do not care about the rest of the world.  Surely you have some proof on illegitimacy of this college and dont have an idea how many people falling for the so called scam (try and assist).  I trully do not think this university means bad at all and looking at their learning style they could be the best of,  NOW as a global community that care for the entirety of this universe (not USA world) lets see how especially those who care about the imporatnce of education try and assist either by advising this intitution to comply but remember that they are not offering these courses to satisfy / meet US educational laws but help those who want to learn and in my view everybody has freedom to choose their education so let them.  Its sickening man US this US that

Hmmm, I think it would be a serious career mistake to obtain a degree from this "university".  Take a look at the dozens of others schools on this site that offer legitimate degrees.

In defense of the US system (I'm not American), they simply have a group of accreditation systems (why not a single one is another issue) which validates that member schools have achieved a particular standard.  The regional accreditation obtained by such institutions implies they have met the standard of highly regarded universities globally. 

There are world bodies that determine equivalency of credentials obtained from these universities with other institutions worldwide.  I assume that this evaluation process is well thought out and has been universally accepted for the most part 

I don’t think anyone is claiming that US regional accreditation is the be all and end all. That being said, Rushmore University for some reason has chosen not to have its programs scrutinized by any neutral 3rd party (American or otherwise).

Does that mean that the school’s programs are poor? No…….It just means that traditional bodies do not recognize them.  Students requiring that type of recognition to further their careers or education should stay clear of this place.

You can get any degree here with a valid credit card

Well all I can say is that no one has questioned the level of my learning at Rushmore nor its suitablility as a learning medium and at the end of the day thats what counts - what you learn. 

I also think that with traditional approaches receiving some unfavorable comments lately about how MBA grads are still ill prepared for actual working environments, the Rushmore approach of research and practical application followed by a written white paper detailing the methodology and the results, counts for a lot (plus the employer directly benefits from the practical aspects).

I don't know about the rest of Europe but in the UK you can study accredited courses up to Masters level (and I believe doctorate) this way - evidence based rather than exam based.

You cannot compare Rochville with Rushmore buddy. Rocheville is in fact a dip Mill, there you do not study anything! At Rushmore University U have to study, research and write either a dissertation or a thesis at the end of your studies, as the case ay be. Why all this fuss! 
Accreditation is not important! America is not the world.

Real accredited degrees for a very low price can be found at NCU.edu, University of Phoenix, Jones International University, Capella, etc.

Maybe there is no regulation of college degrees in Europe, in which case, feel free to buy a Rushmore degree.

Personally, if you are considering an unaccredited Rushmore degree, get one from Rochville University instead, where you can get that same unaccredited degree in 5-7 business days for $399, with "no exams", "no classes", "no waiting".

I guess it all comes out the same in the end.

Without resorting to US accreditation/governmant can someone ask me why the teaching methods are value-less? 

I am thinking of taking a degree with them but apart from the American's here who keep going on about USA accreditation, others seem to say good things about the value of what they learnt and that the teaching method is worthwhile and a good experience.

I am not living in the USA.

Hey European, get out of this forum. We are talking about Rushmore University here, we are not talking about which nations are "criminal fakes". That is a rabbit hole which we don't want to go to. 

Going back to my statement, get some studying done with this university and become an informed commentator about it...

We don't want to hear from US "government officials" anything about fakery. The election of their president was a fake, 9/11 was a fake and the illegal aggression on Iraq was based on criminal fakes. The economy and the Dollar: no longer based on real values. Why should we listen to people who like to murder others like in the dark ages, to run illegal camps like Guantanamo Bay as if they're facists? What could such a goverment tell the world about rights and law and diploma mills and knowledge and humanity...? Nothing.

http://chronicle.com/colloquylive/2004/06/diploma/

Here is a chat transcript on diploma mills where Rushmore is described as "pretending to be a legitimate school" by a government official.  Title = "fighting fakery"

Here are the 7 seven states where it is outright illegal (10 total with various restrictions) to use an unaccredited Kennedy Western / Warren National "degree".

It is also illegal in North Dakota, New Jersey, Texas, Nevada, Washington and Maine to use unaccredited degrees. It is illegal in Indiana to use an unaccredited doctorate and Michigan law limits the legal options of users. Illinois limits the use of unaccredited degrees to those licensed by other states.

See those states’ laws

http://www.osac.state.or.us/oda/unaccred......

for details. Many other states are considering similar laws in order to prevent fraud."

First off, the person who posted the "No, I was referring to unaccredited "universities" such as this one..." blurb, was not me.

I am indeed referring to the Rushmore University (www.rushmore.edu) which, from my perspective, is completely legitimate.

I am a PhD candidate at this faculty now, looking forward to complete the studies. My assigned professor is prominent figure in United States, and she most definitely isn't a part of any bogus diploma mil. 

To the "max" who posted in my name so to speak, I say: 
get a life!

kind regards
Maximilian S.

"Now let us all forget all this issue on accreditation and focus on something more important and useful"

I agree... how about we discuss relevance?

Yak! A course of study cannot be bought! You do not buy knowledge or intellect! You didn't know this, did you?  Now, lets us forget all this issue on accreditation and focus on something more important and useful?

"I have studied with Rushmore University and got an MBA degree"

It's poor grammar to refer to an unaccredited "degree" without the quotes. 

I understand you have buyer's remorse, but...

sure! This last post from (...) summs up all the issue raised so far. We all are idiots. FACTS NON VERBA! period. I have studied with Rushmore University and got an MBA degree. The knowledge I have amassed with my studies has helped me (to) save a company that was insolvent. Am I happy? Sure! Is the company happy? Of course! Is my degree worthless? It can´t be less worthless than the Managing Director of the company who has a Ph.D from an accredited University in the EE and was unable to fix up the financial mess the company was going through.

Andrew, I have a PhD from a highly regarded school in the US and have been very active in my field (i.e. presenting papers, writing books, journal articles, etc.) and have many friends and colleagues that earned degrees from less prestigious schools and have come to the conclusion that accredited institutions and prestige are only skin deep or shallow at best. What matters is the quality of work a student or scholar produces. If a Rushmore student or a student from any unaccredited school makes a significant contribution in their field or has a novel idea, no one is going to care what school the individual came from. The funny thing is the same people will still be promoting the same conjecture and the student that comes up with the novel idea will be the one making the contribution.

I stumbled on this website by accident and laughed when I saw what people were writing. It's amazing how people take opinions for fact. As a scholar about the only thing anyone can say for sure is that we CAN'T EVER be 100% sure about anything, especially something as subjective as the quality of an education. At the PhD level it's who you work with as your advisor not what school you attend.

Well said and that was the exact point of one of my post above.  

Don't tell me this law in this state says this... (I don't live in America).  Tell me why my knowledge (the attainment of which is what this is all about - unless you use your degree more as a designer badge) be any less than others who joined a trad school when I am 

1. Following the same course as a trad school and using the same books and case studies,

2. Questioning and receiving feedback from my coworkers who have MBA's from accredited UK universities (and who know all about the Rushmore program), and

3. Continually monitoring my learning with a friend who is studying for his MBA at a brick and mortar (and with whom I often "spar" over a case analysis).

My question still remains unanswered (oh by the way I also hold accredited qualifications from trad./accredited schools and professional institutions as well as earning a fellowship).

I believe most of those who wish the worst of Rushmore university are just jelous. The fact is that may be they have not been able to capture a large number of students in the world! Rushmore University degres are well received in many parts of the world and by many government agencies. They do not care whether the University is accredited or not because accreditation in those parts of the world has no significant meaning. What really matters is the knowledge you have amassed with your studies and the contribution you can impart positively to society and business. The rest is just an irrelevant issue. DS and big John Bear Crisis are right. I aggre with them. To my view those who wish the worst of Rushmore university are just jelous. They have not been able to inovate in the 21 century, period.

Every single person in this forum has failed to supply any supporting evidence for their claims, especially the members of this forum that have given a negative review. Unless you have taken the time to compare the course work with course work from an accredited university don't sit here and pull opinions out of your rear because you feel like it. The only people in here that even have a leg to stand on are the ones that have actually taken courses there, but again not one single person has conducted any noteworthy research to validate their claims. Now if you call yourself an academic then back it up, do what academics do use hard evidence. I'm not ruling either way on this topic because I have no experience with the university, however, please give thoughtful responses and not worthless opinions.

States where it is illegal with link July 27, 2007 at 3:54 p.m.

Here are the 7 seven states where it is outright illegal (10 total with various restrictions) to use an unaccredited Kennedy Western / Warren National "degree".

"Is Oregon the only state that disallows use of unaccredited degrees?

No. It is also illegal in North Dakota, New Jersey, Texas, Nevada, Washington and Maine to use unaccredited degrees. It is illegal in Indiana to use an unaccredited doctorate and Michigan law limits the legal options of users. Illinois limits the use of unaccredited degrees to those licensed by other states.

See those states’ laws

http://www.osac.state.or.us/oda/unaccred...

for details. Many other states are considering similar laws in order to prevent fraud."

To all of you who wish the worst of Rushmore, I suggest you take up studies through it and then come back and make informed comments about your experience. As it is you are just demonstrating just how close minded and ignorant you really are. If this is what your "real" schools have taught you to think than the supposed education you received from them is worthless. And don't come at me with arguments that say this jurisdication and that jurisdiction does not accept Rushmore degrees, that in fact they consider them illegal. This just tells me that you can't do any original thinking on your own to back up your argument. So just get yourself in a position to make informed judgements on the matter by taking up studies with Rushmore U.

...and oh you, I do have a masters degree from a respected "bricks and mortar" university as well a prospective degree from Rushmore.

I have just bought two degrees from two different universities-providers of fake diplomas - one in HR management and another in Sociology under the names of my cat Piny Wendy and my dog Flint wilburry. I was asked no questions just filled in the application form and my credit card details. I will get the diplomas by next week! No need to study or to write anything! My pets cannot read, of course. But they have just graduated in HR management and Sociology. However, my sister whos is studying for almost six months, researching, reading and writing papers to get her degree in management - many people call her university a Dip. Mill!

Accreditation is not important in many parts of the world. Besides, not being  accredited by the US Education Department Rushmore University cannot be equated with diploma mill institution. A diploma mill sells degrees does not teach you anything! By the the way, do you guys beleive that if Socratas, Jesus and  Thomas Edison were alive today would they  buy  diplomas or degrees to demonstrate their knowledge base? Think of this gentlemen!

I am so amused by this conversation, online learning has been around for many years and is now only gaining the acceptance that it deserves in the form of regional accreditation for these online schools.

Unfortunately, Rushmore isn't one of them.  It's from the old school of mail order degrees

Rushmore University?  Come on, this is the 21st century, 10 minutes on Google will allow you to learn all you need to know about an unaccredited degree you can get from these sham universities.

For the same price, go to a real school and get a degree that won't be a stain on your resume.

Easy / fasy schools like rushmore, Kennedy Western, Warren National, Almeda, Rochville should raise some red flags for you.

The State of Texas calls Rushmore "University" a:

Fraudulent or Substandard Institution with No Known Texas Connection

Fraudulent or substandard degree" means a degree conferred in Texas in violation of the Texas Education Code

http://www.thecb.state.tx.us/AAR/Private...

Traditional Colleges and Universities ( Accredited/Charted/Deemed ) should continue to resist the Rushmores of the world. Traditional US accredited universities and colleges were one of the first to offer distance education programs and courses. "Distance education traces its origins to mid-19th century Europe and the United States. American university level distance education began in 1874 at Illinois Wesleyan University where bachelor and graduate degrees could be obtained in absentia. The Chautauqua movement in about 1882 gave the popular push to correspondence education. Accreditation of college and university distance programs fell to the National University Extension Association in 1915." http://www.cdlponline.org/index.cfm?fuseaction=whatis&pg=3
"Illinois Wesleyan, founded in 1850, is a private co-educational university with an enrollment of 2,100 and a student/faculty ratio of 12 to 1"
http://www2.iwu.edu/aboutiwu/

Rushmore has no meaningingful recognition from any meaningful organization in ANY country.  They have:

*A website
*A credit card machine
*A diploma printer

And that's about it.  Stop trying to convince anyone otherwise.

"Look! Oxford, her sisters and brothers will refuse you entry. Rushmore will take you"

True, but only with a valid credit card.

Dear Forummembers,

In Belgium it is fully legal to use and mention Rushmore degrees if the holder puts the institutions name with it. This is also true for degrees of other countries be it from Oxford or Harvard. Do not forget studing is in the first instance about obtaining knowledge and in the second place about accreditation. Even within the European Union there are official and accredited college and university degrees where one EU country does not accept other EU country degrees. Examples are a Belgian Bachelor in Nursing is not accredited for the Netherlands government without one extra year study to equal there Bachelor of Nursing and a German Dentist has to do a lot of examinations to be allowd to practice in Belgium and this all after Bologna treaties en regulations. I also contacted 2 of Rushmore alumni (Peter Schultz, Netherlands and George Seil, Luxembourg) and they both admitted that studying at Rushmore was a very challeging experience. The put it simple if you do not write a word on paper you get no credits or GPA for it so having parties all year round and then still passing exams is not the Rushmore way. Rushmore's minimum passing grade is a B which is about 70-80%. In Belgium it is now 50%. Furthermore after you pass an essay you always have written evidence of you achievements. Which exam using university had this except for a sometimes worthless degree transcript.
Yours sincerely,

Peter Meijaers
prospective Rushmore student

Anyone who blacklists Rushmore should apply and taste the quality of their worth. You'll be surprised how hard they make you work. I'm a Med holder now taking a PhD at Rushmore (Education Administration). Alongside studying, I work with graduates from top class UK and American universities. Non, I mean non of those high sounding DOCTORS with US and UK best-university-ink in their brains can't compare with me. I'm able to publish a best selling social research book thanks to Rushmore. Look! Oxford, her sisters and brothers will refuse you entry. Rushmore will take you. The day you graduate, some of these Oxfordians, Harvardians, Cambridgians etc will sit when you talk. Be careful! I didn't blacklist Oxford and Cos standards. What I don't understand is why they refuse us who are better than some of those they admit. Trust me; Rushmore is as good as good as Ox, Harvard, etc. Try them now. God bless Rushmore

Fraudalent, substandard, violation, misdemeanor, illegal.  I guess that ends this conversation.

In Oregon, it is only a misdemeanor to use a Rushmore "degree" without the lengthy disclaimer.  For the non-Americans, Misdemeanor translates to ILLEGAL...

"In addition, an individual using an unaccredited degree, even if the employer allows use of such degrees, must disclose on resumes, letterheads, business cards, announcements and advertisements that "(Name of school) does not have accreditation recognized by the United States Department of Education and has not been approved by the Office of Degree Authorization." ORS 348.609(2)(a). The only exception is for schools approved by ODA. See ORS 348.609(d) and OAR 583-050-0014.

It is a Class B Misdemeanor under the Oregon Criminal Code to use a degree in violation of ORS 348.609."

The State of Texas calls Rushmore "University" a:

Fraudulent or Substandard Institution with No Known Texas Connection

Fraudulent or substandard degree" means a degree conferred in Texas in violation of the Texas Education Code

http://www.thecb.state.tx.us/AAR/PrivateInstitutions/fraudnotx.cfm

I am so amused by this conversation, online learning has been around for many years and is now only gaining the acceptance that it deserves.  Granted there must be quality standards and control but labeling an institution a mill without good reason is sad.

My undergrad degree is from an online institution (supported by a brick and mortar school), believe me, I worked my buns off and can stand up in any forum and hold my own.

The long and short is that traditionals will always resist the Rushmores of this world simply because they threaten their way of being (and maybe the milking cow)....did someone say "who moved my cheese?"

Except Andrew, who studied there and found it unacceptable ? Please tell why, thanks. I want to have a global idea and also from non-Amercican students.

There is no opinion to this, it's a scam, even calling a "college" or a "degree" is incorrect.

It has nothing to do with American or other accreditation.  It doesn't even make the minimum requirements to have a discussion about.

Registrar Don - Maybe in America but that doesn't mean the rest of the world ...Oh sorry, Americans think they are the world, but hey lets not start another middle-east like crisis over this.  You say its unacceptable others say its ok, we respect each others opinion.

It's a joke and a Diploma Mill, pure and simple.

Jim-HR  I think you take my words out of context!

Though you are right to call it unaccredited you cannot call it a joke nor a Dip. Mill.  Even the unacceptable state lists you mention have altered their entry for Rushmore removing any suggestion it is a mill. Don't forget by your own laws, accreditation by the US Department of Education is voluntary.  Also the weight and stature of some of it's advisors, the late Phillip Crosby, business and quality guru, Tom Lambert, internationally known and respected consultant, and Andrew Goodman, a London Barrister, say otherwise.

However considering my comments above about how I have modelled my courses, how can you suggest that the "knowledge" I recieve is different to someone who attends a brick and mortar institute?  Several papers have already been published in respected British journals and some of my findings I have presented at my place of work and have been actioned on with good results.  My study at Rushmore has directly led to improvements for my employer.

When other institutes of which you may recognise are following a very similiar route to Rushmore's, completely online, no residency etc, what becomes the differenciating criteria?  My argument is, it is only the name.  However noticing the importance of a name I also point out that it may be good for Rushmore to associate itself with another "acceptable" university like the Robert Kennedy College has done with their University of Wales partnership.

Andrew

I work in HR, and we routinely ship Rushmore "degrees" to the trash can and shake our heads.  It's an unaccredited joke with no academic value based on our research and the unacceptable lists of several states.

Please don't call yourself "doctor" and please don't apply at our organization.

Even the reviews supposedly supporting this "university" show what a scam it is.  Graduate classes are based on the number of words you can put on a page?  Unbelievable.

"It takes approximately 10 - 15 courses to achieve the Rushmore MBA and forget the 3,000 word limit on course work they mention.  From my experience you should be aiming for 5,000 or above per course if you want the credits, and multiple citations throughout from at least 10 different sources."

There are other universities that offer similiar courses to Rushmore's.  I was looking on the ICSlearn website a few days ago that offered distance, online MBA's from the Robert Kennedy College, Zurich whose degrees are vailidated by the UK government accredited University of Wales.  To quote the site (http://www.icslearn.co.uk/distance-learning-degree/business/master-business-admin/) "With online assessments and no formal examinations to attend, the online MBA provides you with an ideal route to achieving this highly valued qualification."

Granted Rushmore can improve.  Introducing core modules such as financial accounting, organisational behaviour, marketing etc. would be a good start and maybe dividing the course into cert. diploma. degree based on credits earnt would be another and more in line with the traditional approach.  With such changes, becoming associated with a degree awarding body would also be a wise move.  But considering other respected institutes of learning are following a no-exam, online assessed route I think referring to them as a dip.mill, based on these properties, as some have, is a little harsh.

With this in mind let me tell you a little bit about my online tailored course.  I chose Rushmore for its price (though the degree mentioned above came close) and because I could study under a professor from the same industry as myself (health care) who has many years experience at the CEO level (though now retired).  As he is no stranger to academia, earning himself a law degree and MBA from traditional UK accredited universities and a visiting professor at several brick-and-mortar institutes in the UK and abroad he knows the standard required for an masters level qualification and ensures I meet it.

I have purposely modelled my elective courses on a traditional MBA, even using the same texts as a brick-and-mortar university uses here in the UK.  Therefore I am covering the same topics and referencing the same sources.  To replace class interaction I discuss points with graduate MBA's in my place of work who are encouraging me in my studies even though they received their degrees from more accepted and established institutes (and yes they do know about Rushmore).  At the end of the course I plan to sit the ICI 6-hour certified MBA exam as a means of receiving external assessment/validation of my degree.

All in all, as Rushmore allows students to model their own unique degrees, there is little difference in the subject matter between a brick-and-mortar MBA and my own, and if all goes to plan next year (2 years after I began my studies) I will sit the final exam.  

To finalise, on what are we basing our assessment that my degree will be worthless?  On what has been learnt, and externally validated, or on the name of the institute who awarded the MBA.  If the latter then the degree is only an item of desgigner branding, not a reflection on a persons knowledge.

Well, how many colleges and universities are in the world and work only online ? no idea myself but here in Europe where I live just the idea to study in a language that it is not your mother tongue and that you have to read and comments books + write reviews is a great thing. Studying and so on like normal people can also be boring for some of the students around. Just think at one thing : USA is not alone in the world

"My point is that we should be careful not to "demonize" an
institution because it is based in the Caymans."

Rushmore is demonized because it is a laughable seller of diplomas with no educational value, not because of their registered place of business.

Just an fyi: The Cayman Islands (Grand Cayman) are legitimate and well known financial and insurance centers. 

Many people link fraud/money laundering/shadow economy to off-shore "franchises," - that largely comes from mass media education (which is unfortunate). 

In fact off-shore is a misnomner, if you reside in Japan but have a business in the U.S. you are doing "off-shore" business. The U.S.A. is "off-shore" for many legitimate international companies (as well as illegal organizations).

My point is that we should be careful not to "demonize" an
institution because it is based in the Caymans.

[Edited by moderator to remove inappropriate language.]
You can not be serious thinking that degree will get you somewhere.  That is such a shame that you even think that Rushmore has prepared you for anything in the real world.

Jayson and Morton you both should have spent the extra money if going online.  Well you know what they say in America...you get what you pay for...

By the way I have "REAL" credentials...I bet you wish you had as well....LoL

Doctor of Management (in progress)
Master of Science in Management
Bachelor of Science in Applied Technology

How can anyone here claim that Rushmore should be a "Diploma Mill" where you can get a "diploma" without courses, for money only, or that Rushmore should be "bogus"? 

People who write such nonsense are obviously no academic people: no thinking people. Sorry.

It's perfect silly because you have to do hard work on books and texts - reading and writing - at Rushmore. 

Their professors know from their real life how to talk about the issues, which the professors of our accreditated system mostly know from books only. 

The Rushmore approach is the most effective way to learn what you really need for your business and personal life today. And you'll get your diploma there only if you've collected the credits - by study work.

News Flash for John Bear.  The USA is not the world.  What about other countries.  You state that certain USA states do not recognise this degree...great, good for them, but who cares what the USA thinks when you live in Outer Mongolia or even Europe for that matter, where I am finding my studies with Rushmore being accepted here in the UK even with full knowledge of its unaccredited status.

Please remember the internet is an international media.

News flash for Andrew.  Even the big pond won't keep you from being eventually found out.  Ignorance of your employer does not equal universal validity.

To restate John Bear's point, everyone knows Rushmore is bogus, but only a few select states have stepped up their enforcement to make Rushmore degrees illegal to use.

Luckily in the states, we have a verification service to weed out the Rushmores' and the Almedas' that lets us throw them on the scrap heap and add one more tick to our 'attempted fraud' column on reports.

To the best of my knowledge, use of a Rushmore degree is a criminal offense in the growing number of states that regulate degree use (Illinois, Texas, Michigan Maine, New Jersey, Illinois, North Dakota, etc.).

we should be realistic in approach. at first without getting to know the proper details, no one should call one FAKE. "Guy with real degree" isn't this it self is fake...

LOL, Site Admin needs to clean up the fake degrees wasting bandwidth on their site.

Rushmore is an unacredited mill on every states radar.  Wouldn't want to be putting that fraud on my resume.

Just begun my MBA with Rushmore after completeing many accredited business courses elsewhere and so far I cannot complain.  I went with Rushmore purely for the price but have been pleasently surprised.

They have a good alumni community from around the world and good advisors in my experience who have all "been there done that."

Also they do hold membership status with the European Council for Business Education so they cannot be all bad as they are a european business school accreditation body.

I think the difference lies in the style of teaching.  Here in Europe we prefer research based learning whereas the US prefer classroom/lecture hall learning.

What is a degree mill school doing on this site?  Rushmore is an unaccredited laugher.

University based in the Cayman Islands, the Oregon Office of Degree Authorization (http://www.osac.state.or.us/oda/unaccredited.html) won't accept Rushmore degrees for employment, and warns it's residents against it as suspect.

If it looks like a mill, smells like a mill....