University of Phoenix

Just a Guy March 30, 2007 at 9:44 p.m.

This program is a joke. I used to work for the school and quit in disgust. If a student deserves to fail, the school administration pressures the professor into passing them. They tell the instructor to "work with the student" to ensure they pass the course. This is so the student can continue in the program and more importantly...CONTINUE PAYING TUITION.

This school is nothing but a machine designed to separate students from their tuition dollars.

NCU, Walden, and Capella are no better.

Go with state supported, regionally accredited, online programs that also have a ground campus. They at least have academic integrity.

Anthem5582 April 12, 2007 at 10:02 p.m.

After acquiring credits from 2 different brick and mortar schools, I decided to complete the last 60 hours of my bachelors’ degree at UOP. Like the other colleges I have attended, some classes prove very challenging while others seem very easy. I will say that while I have been at UOP I have had to do more writing than I have ever had to do at any time during my education. I find the UOP classes very engaging because class discussions are performed via an online message board. When the professor posts specific questions about the reading material, the students have no choice but to read and interpret the information. You can't sit in the back of an online class and simply dodge the instructor. I have also had very few multiple choice tests. Most final exams are 1100+ word written assignments in conjunction with a 15 to 20 minute presentation. I don't know about you but I am a lost on how to fake my way through that.

As far as in the business world, I work for the largest health insurance company in the US. I have received a promotion during my time with UOP and currently in the running for a management position. I have listed my studies with UOP on my resume and have had no shortage of job opportunities.

In light of my positive remarks about UOP, I have decided that upon graduation in January, I will go on to complete my MBA with an online business school accredited by the AACSB (East Carolina University).

Overall I guess my advice to anyone considering UOP is to do your research. Like every school, UOP has its pro’s and con’s. Ultimately, I think a UOP education is what you make of it.

just a guy April 30, 2007 at 10:12 a.m.

Kyle,

If you failed a class than you must have not attended or turned in anything. They will pass you if you put forth just minimum effort, even if you deserve to fail.

TC May 19, 2007 at 7:37 p.m.

I thought the school was not good at all, but not everyone in the business world feels it is pointless. A few months after I get my BSIT I got a job with a world wide based company (John deere) and am making 3 times what I made before.

If I had it to do over I would have never taken classes at UOP, but it does not mean it did not pay off.

for Daniel June 3, 2007 at 4:57 p.m.

Daniel congrats on being admitted to the program. From personal experiences with online graduate or PHD work I would head towards the direction of a non profit institution or a school with a reputation for the program you are entering. Personally I wouldn’t try for a PHD with any online for profit universities, the reason why is because if you are getting your PHD you are planning to enter the field of research and academics which in itself is non profit work for most people so why go with a for profit institution for your PHD?

You need to also consider where you will be after you get your PHD from Nova Southeastern. Who will employ you, offer you a position what kind of schools will grant a position with a degree from Nova Southeastern?

I would look towards state universities such as Dakota state or any other well known university that offers a program via distance learning. Also don’t sell yourself short to only distance learning programs if you are near a grouping of well known university its worth the education and effort to try to get admitted to those schools, it will benefit you in the long run.

The big problem with online education today is for many people is too easy an option rather then going to class I've always felt that if you have quality schools near by (1/2-1 hour away)you should consider those schools first and if you have no luck with schools near you then I would search for distance learning programs with the highest quality possible and work down from there, I would try to avoid online for profit schools at all costs and do my best to get admitted to better non profits schools

DR.mcike July 21, 2007 at 5:43 p.m.

avoid online schools at all cost. An online school is not credible. Example as a chair of a department i wouldnt reccomend admitting a student for a Masters program who came from a online school. When new graduates from online Phd programs apply to become professors with my department, they are never called for an interview. Online programs are not trusted within the college and university system.

question August 9, 2007 at 8:21 p.m.

I understand how everyone feels about online schools and accreditation, but what if you HAVE to work 40 hours a week and you HAVE to take care of your child/ren? Online school is my only option. I want to further my current management position but I don't have the time to be at school all day. What should I do? I just applied to Strayer University. Did I make a big mistake? Which is better Strayer or Devry?? And please dont say neither. Sometimes you just have to settle with what you have to work with. This is better than nothing in my opinion. Right?

UOPPRO August 15, 2007 at 6:53 p.m.

DR.mcike,

If you're a Department Chair, then I'm the Queen of England. You can't even put together a coherent sentence!

And to all of you other liars, bitter dropouts, and basic flunkies out there, UOP is a regionally accredited, campus based program that offes online modality. They are also accredited through the ACBSP. Education will be what you make of it, no matter where you go, and the only difference between UOP and traditional schools, is UOP actually paid attention to the educational needs of working adults, and brought education to them on their terms, instead of the other way around.

Educational elitists who believe that a good education should be reserved only for those students that can bring a 4.0 GPA and a full time job-free schedule will always resent UOP for doing what they could, but won't, offer a valuable, relevant, applicable educaiton to anyone who has the drive and motivation to pursue it!

Right on DR.mcike September 7, 2007 at 6:45 p.m.

Like it or not, DR.mcike is right. If you don't like his answer, tough. He is the representing the majority of academic instititions. Sorry if you wasted money on a PhD from an online, but nobody respects those degrees.

I weep for the future September 7, 2007 at 9:44 p.m.

I really do folks. It is a sorry state of affairs when someone attends UoP. The school has nothing to offer and most students I have had the opportunity to meet from UoP are dolts at best. Sorry, but for those that aren't dolts, the others ruin your name. A degree from UoP will do nothing but tarnish your resume and you would be well advised to leave it off. With that in mind, why leave it off intentionally, just don't go.

Dr. McGillicutty September 7, 2007 at 9:49 p.m.

I will tell you that no self respecting drinker would attend UoP. Go to a B&M campus or your party life will suffer!

Fake September 11, 2007 at 3:09 p.m.

True This is humorous. Sorry, but the 100% acceptance rate and the fact that they report to stockholders and not to employers is something that will never be valued. UoP is for bottom feeders.

True September 12, 2007 at 8:16 p.m.

Profit only comes from offering a superior product that meets demand.

Tony September 21, 2007 at 2:29 a.m.

Univ. of Phoenix must be among the best in order to receive business program accreditation from ACBSP. I recently completed an MBA-Healthcare Management degree at UOP and received numerous employment interests.

Just a Guy September 30, 2007 at 11:44 p.m.

AACSB is the one that really matters anyway. If you don't have AACSB accredidation most academics will look down on you. ACBSP accredidation is a joke.

What? October 1, 2007 at 1:09 p.m.

Good point out Just A Guy. Also, the ACBSP accrediation is only in a candidate state. Understand also they have some people who did the initial review openly admit to fear of being sued by one of Pheonix's 30 lawyers. UoP is not among the best Tony, not even close. When I get resumes in and review them, the UoP people go in one pile and everyone else goes in another.

What? October 2, 2007 at 1:49 p.m.

Well that’s a bit harsh "To all considering online education...". I worked as a full professor at one of the highest reputable schools in the world. Carnegie Melon University, Massachusetts Institute of Technology, Harvard, and Rochester Institute of Technology all have online MS programs. I would tell you the MIT and CMU students have been picked up to teach adjunct at some of the best schools. So your "academics" world may be one that thinks its an Ivy, but it really isn't.

I am not against online at all. In fact, I would think it would be more difficult to teach yourself. I am against it in some fields (like Engineering BS where you need labs, but MS you might not need labs), but I am totally against the FOR-PROFIT online schools.

Tell you what "To all considering online education...", I have a PhD from one of the number one schools in the world in Engineering, but I also have an MS I just earned from CMU online in July. You wouldn't consider hiring me?

Why? October 4, 2007 at 3:02 p.m.

Hate the player, hate the game! Yo, I am at Phoenix student and it is the schdizzle. I can hang outt with my peeps bustin it up and still go to the P. Check it out, I just gotto show up and I am bustin out with C's and B's yo. Go hear man, they let anybody in and you no you gotzta to the paper to make it.

And October 5, 2007 at 12:31 a.m.

And they teach great Ebonics because the people that attend cannot speak English.

And October 5, 2007 at 1:09 p.m.

I did. I love how easy it is. I did nothing except pay and got out. I hear UoP hired a rapper to go to school there. That might be you. I also hear the guy is dumb. I don't want myself to be associated with him.

The P October 5, 2007 at 10:32 p.m.

Check it, the P is da bomb. You dogz gottsta see tat all you be doin is rippin on da school dat make da Havard types look wack crazy. Da schoolz like Havard don't got nuttin on the P. Yous needs to check it befor you reck it ya'll. I be checkin out da P tis yeer and I did it wit the 3.1 average ya'll. I be rippin it with the homies cause I be casin da streetz with the skins now. I be up in all yaall faces now. I be managin now, da BK down on by da river in the JAX, FL.

What? October 6, 2007 at 3:19 a.m.

What Ivy? If you let me know, I will be sure to send my CV in.

Translation October 8, 2007 at 11:58 a.m.

If you would like to recieve an education that will get you a job paying almost $20,000 a year, please attend UoP. Once you do, Ivy's will still not respect you. UoP teaches ebonics in place of English because it will be much more useful in your future careers.

Yo Dog... October 9, 2007 at 3:48 p.m.

I be for real! Ya be wack if ya think da P and me ain't down G's with da wack edamucation. I be writin da paper and da be givin da B and C and I be gettin da degree.

Da P down wit the homies!

Ha ha October 10, 2007 at 4:53 p.m.

Ya, get a degree from here. Its an expensive piece of toilet paper! Phoenix is the worst kind of school. They want your money and don't care if you get an education. You pass every class as long as you pay. Save yourself time and find a school like Lacross University who will issue credits based off of "life experience" and you can get your PhD for just $2500!

Degree October 11, 2007 at 2:17 p.m.

How much does it cost to complete a doctor at this school starting from ground up? I haven't gone to college yet, but now I want to go and become a doctor.

Da P October 14, 2007 at 6:52 p.m.

You be buggin if you be dinking dat the da "P" aint da place to be. Da P be gettin the R E S P E C T from all people.

Da P October 16, 2007 at 2:55 p.m.

You be on my man...

You pay, you be gettin in and you be gettin da degre. Da respectabe degre.

Da P October 16, 2007 at 4:39 p.m.

You ain't down wit the P if you decree you set fire to the G. Gangsters be talkin and best be listenin. Da P free the homies and Da P pass all da homies. Check yourself my man and understand dat da P be the place to be. We be gettin jobs wit crazy bling bling danks to da P.

UoP October 16, 2007 at 4:45 p.m.

And I got straight As!

Hold on a minute!!! October 16, 2007 at 10:08 p.m.

I have completed a four and half year degree in finance from a brick and mortar university. Now I attend the University of Phoenix, and I anticipate graduation with my MBA in February of 2008.Currently I attend the ground campus in Houston TX, and my experience has been very good. It’s all about your professor, not the school.

Some professors take time and teach you essential tools necessary to make it in competitive world today. Some just have neither passion nor desire to teach and therefore, the students suffer.

Given that I’m a ground campus student I cannot comment on the online experience. However, I do intend to attend Walden University for my PhD in Business Finance. I have asked my PhD professor’s about Walden, and it is very well respected in the business world.

There will always be comparisons in life, Mercedes VS BMW, Harvard VS Yale, or Online VS Ground Campus. Who’s to say which is better or worse? It’s all about your experience and what you do with your education. The masters of success learn to gather all of their personal experiences and focus them on what’s relative to accomplish their personal goals.

I don’t depend on my degree to get me into a career opportunity. I depend on my ability retain all my educational experiences and apply them to the best of my ability. If you are an exceptional candidate for employment you will get the job. Someone will value you and not so much the educational background.

In closing, you have to sell your self. I know a girl who graduated from Rice University with a 3.7 in Business Management who is selling cars on a small lot for a living. So, therefore, it’s not about where you get the education, but rather how you apply what you have learned in your life. Don’t depend on the degree, depend on the knowledge. That is the true power.

Kind Regards,

D. Williams

Hold on a minute!! October 17, 2007 at 4:13 a.m.

Thank you very much for the comment, I would never compare Harvard to the University of Phoenix. Ivy league schools are Ivy league schools. They are the best for a reason. However, a true man on understanding knows that judging someone based off their differences, whether it be schools, race, religion, or gender, or sex is not a man of wisdom. I am 25 years old, I own a very nice home, purchased 5 BMW's with in the last year, and I have very nice opportunities waiting for me to finish my MBA. So, when you say get a life, I have mine. Now my friend, how is yours? I am reaping a return on my investment. Of course, we both now that everyone will not do the same as I with my education, but even so, we are no better than anyone who does choose to pursue online universities. So in others words, If you don't like it, fine, but don't discourage individuals who are doing the best they can to get an education. For some people it is their only option, and who are you to judge. I guess if you were so happy with your education, you wouldn't be wasting time picking on people who choose else where. I pray that you are never in a situation where someone judges you because of where you went to school. Say.....you went to brown but you were denied because didn't graduate from Yale. My best friend graduated from Princeton, so it does happen. So in closing, judge not and you shall not be judged, for what ever measure you judge, so shall you be judged in that day. (hopefully you know where this comes from, and if not then i feel even more sorry for you, then it would become very clear as to why you are so prideful and judgemental)

Kind Regards,

D. Williams

Hold on a minute!!! October 17, 2007 at 5:11 p.m.

That’s the same as saying, "if you’re not rich or wealthy, you should not be able to go to an Ivy League school." Which, by the way don’t have financial aid departments? Even so, $5,000 doesn't help pay for 50k in tuition fees a year, don’t you think? Look, the bottom line is that not everyone has the same opportunities available for advancement in life. You have to play the cards you’re dealt with. If I could do it all over, I would have gone to pharmacy school. Having said that, it is important to understand that nobody is saying its better than the traditional experience, but rather it was the best option for them at the time being. There is nothing wrong with choosing that option. As long as a person can get what they want out of their degree or education that’s all that matters, wouldn't you agree? But don’t be mad at for profit institutions, how about pharmacies, have you ever read the mission statement of these corporations, "To get people to buy more drugs" not to heal people from using them. Yet, when you go to the Dr. you probably take your prescribed medicine. We don’t even do research on the cure percentage rate, which is usually 10-20%. There are other major issues in this world to complain about that are truly hurting the economy and effecting individuals lives. But choosing to judge on educational preferences, I think we can find other constructive things to work on. How about the United States is one of 3 countries in the world who don’t pay for health care, yet we are one of the most profitable nations in the world. And you choose to complain about individuals educational preferences. Find something else to pick on people about. Education with out wisdom is foolishness. Wouldn’t you agree?

Degree October 17, 2007 at 7:36 p.m.

If you don't like the way health care is run in the US, move to another country or go and change it. I hate the for profits because they rip students off by offering a better future and lie about things to get it. Pharmacy at least is regulated and they have to tell you side effects. Schools don't tell students "you are taking out a loan for $4000 at 17% interest because we cost so much your federal loans don't cover it". They also don't tell you alternatives like Community College that is better in name and price. Pharmacy at least offers generic for a way better price. I do not respect UoP in any way. It is worthless because they are using tax payer money to keep student in school and graduating morons. And no, I did not attend that school or any for profit. I did teach at a couple though, and thats what made me hate them (the way they treated students as "customers" or (I shutter) "learners".

Degree October 17, 2007 at 7:40 p.m.

(continued)

4) Spam mail and heavy advertising comparing the University to the elites. This plays into number 3 above also giving people the sense that UoP is the most respected University because it has over 300K+ students enrolled. They have since changed this, but I still hate it.

5) Lack of accreditation from AACSB and ABET. While not all schools have this, UoP puts on their sites all about accreditation. Many people claim UoP is accredited by the same places that accredit Harvard. This is true, but government accreditation is the minimum a school needs to issue degrees. It speaks nothing of the quality of the degree, except there are enough classes in place to grant one. And why the lack of ABET and AACSB? Well, Number 1 is part of the issue, but number 6 is better.

6) 95% adjuncts? Come on now. A real University has real tenure professors doing research and trying to increase the level of education and effectiveness of the program. Sure, having adjuncts gets you business experience. But there is a place for them, we call them boards. They help look at the curriculum. Also, this “real world experience” is a bunch of BS too. When you’re in school (undergraduate, graduate, or just non-credit), that’s the real world. There is no such thing as a school that doesn’t give “real world” experience, even ITT or Devry or UoP (I know tons of schools say that line).

7) Lack of Ethics. UoP has displayed this in the cases against enrollment. The school is for-profit and reports to share holders, not students. They need to reinvest more money back into the school and less back to the shareholders. The previous entry about adjuncts also shows the ethics are low. Adjuncts do not have as much stake as a tenure professor since most of them work for the paycheck, not the recognition. Tenure might not be able to get fired, but the reputation can easily be hurt.

8 ) This is mean, but some of the graduates from UoP I have met seem to feel the world owes them something because they completed a degree. This is my own opinion on this one. This is the case with many for-profits. I believe it is because many schools like ITT are known for “hand holding” and help students that might not make it elsewhere. So when they are done, they are looking for “hand holding” and don’t know what to do. This is also probably because of number 3 (enrollment councilors) lying to them.

Hold on a minute!!! October 17, 2007 at 9:34 p.m.

Ya know, you are right, all those things listed are some things I have experienced. However, it is the way of the fast paced environment today. All schools are now attempting to offer distance learning programs in order to keep up with the competition because traditonal schools are noticing their enrollments numbers decrease. I could have gone to a traditional school for my MBA, I choose not to. Again, I dont depend on the school to get me a jobs, I depend on the education. Currently I am accounting and Finance Recruiter. I have interviewed people who have masters degrees from UT, Rice, and others who are seeking 30,000 job. You know why, because part of life is about who you know not what you know. Its a complicated balance that makes sense. The thing is.....no school can teach you that. That is wisdom learned out side of the school. The wonderfull thing about Ivy league schools is the contacts you make there. Remember I know someone who has been there and finished, Do you? I have more opportunities afforded to me because of who I know. Yet, I dont depend on those. I will make my own way. Well, I respect you opinion. Everyone has a right to it. However, remember that everyone is not or was not as fortunate as you, so try not judge so much. Thats discriminating against someone being black. You know that children born had no idea that being black in america was hard back then, but they still suffered. We can change the way we view people now days for the most part. Take care. God Bless you!

Great October 18, 2007 at 2:31 a.m.

This is Great. I Love reading Degree. Degree posts only the truth. You UoP grads can't handle the school sucks and is worthless and money hungry.

Degree October 18, 2007 at 4:42 p.m.

I rate people on education because its a sold indicator of the potential of the person. I hire people expecting the college has already filtered people and only brought the best output. Phoenix has no admissions and makes money on students. They have every reason to get the student through the entire program to maximize profit.

Dr. B. October 18, 2007 at 6:42 p.m.

Someone stated that the AACSB was better than ACBSP... that's not exactly true. Neither one are competitors of each other. Both are the only two business accrediting bodies recognized by CHEA. Both have separate aims and core values.... AACSB focuses on research whereas ACBSP focuses on teaching excellence. Most small colleges/universities or their academic counterparts seek accreditation through the ACBSP.

Also... just to throw this out there, the president of Tougaloo College is a doctoral (DOM) alumnus of UoP. She's doing quite well.

As for UoP, I do think the university has a better chance of revamping its reputation if it broke away from the for-profit arena. This would allow it to focus more on teaching and research... the important things in academics. It would also allow students to receive outside funding for their academic work.

Dr. B October 18, 2007 at 7:50 p.m.

HAHAHAHAHAHA....

I never said that UoP was a good school. I never said it was a bad school. But it is an institution that has been able to sustain for many years....regardless of criticism. Plus... for people to enroll and then criticize the institution after they've withdrawn.... I see something wrong with that. I mean... isn't it flexbility and open admissions that drew them there in the first place? lol.... of course unless you're investigating something like the impact of open enrollment on student attrition and success in for-profit institutions.

UoP is an institution for individuals looking to advance their career. They're most likely not aspiring to be great researchers or tenured faculty..... it's a working man's (woman's) school. Plus, a majority of its students are in the military anyway. They're gonna get advancement whether we like it or not.

Many people who graduate from there go on to do great things..... and I agree, if you push, the education received from there can be rewarding.

Respondants... as I've informed you before, I too am an academic snob.... no need to tell you why again. But we must be open-minded and resolved in the fact that institutions like UoP are not going anywhere anytime soon. My only wish is that they stop being so predatory in recruitment and financial aid....... and get off the for-profit belt.

Respondants... lets get back to work. :-) Good to see you again old friend. lol

Respondants October 18, 2007 at 8:35 p.m.

The AACSB gold standard I will look for references later, but I know from personal experiences, that is the gold standard. Even if you compare the two lists of the accrediting schools, AACSB is usually "A" schools.

AACSB also has nothing to do with Doctoral Degrees, mostly just MBAs. THe new DBA is up. MBA used to be equivalent to a PhD, but not so much anymore. Same as an MFA. But UoP does not meet my standard for education. Its not that I am saying it shouldn't exist, I am just saying they offer sub-par education in my opinion. Before I get bashed, please note the "My Opinion" part of what that sentence.

Back to work? I work in acadmics (well, close enough). That means I have never worked a day in my life!:)

Being Honest October 18, 2007 at 10:57 p.m.

Capella, UOP, ITT, and any other for profit university is sub par and so are the students. No one should take anyone with a degree from these institutions seriously. Students in these schools are the worst of the best and the best of the worst (and maybe they are neither, they may just be the worst of the worst). I question whether these students should even be allowed breed for fear that their below average genes may be allowed to create another sub par human with below average intellect whom will either turn out to be a derelict or a garbage man. I will not say I am sorry because I am not. These so-called students make me sick as an educated man and frankly they do not deserve jobs in academia and they do not deserve jobs in the professional business world either. Allowing these “students” into management will most certainly translate into a failed business and allowing them into academia will only further desecrate our educational system.

My question to any online supporter is simple, “How could you possibly support a sub par educational system and support these no minds that come out of these institutions that actually think they are qualified to work in any management function (including a head housekeeper) or any level of academia (including the mail room clerk)?” Honestly people, with this their can be no debate, online education from for profit schools simply cannot be taken seriously and any argument otherwise should be dismissed.

Now to address you Respondants. You state, "The AACSB gold standard I will look for references later, but I know from personal experiences, that is the gold standard. Even if you compare the two lists of the accrediting schools, AACSB is usually "A" schools." This is rich. You say "usually," an A school. Your statement alone loses the debate with the word "usually." Now, come back when you can actually carry a debate like an educated person. If you are educated by a B&M, clearly you slipped through the cracks.

Being Honest October 19, 2007 at 1:46 a.m.

Then, from one Ivy Leaguer (MIT as well) to another, what is your interest in for-profits and what are their place? Please expound.

Perhaps I was too crass with you, so I apologize.

Being Honest October 19, 2007 at 3:42 a.m.

Interesting point of view. One additional question if I may, "What for profits are 'good' and 'bad'?"

Attention online fools! October 21, 2007 at 7:32 p.m.

If you go to UoP you are stupid and it is as simple as that. You have no business working, teaching or anything else. Just so I have made not mistakes, this includes ALL online schools like ITT, DeVry, Capella, Jones University, etc. Also, if you go to an online school from a traditional B&M campus, you fall into the same category. In conclusion, argue all you want, if you are to lazy to get of your butt to a classroom, you have NO business working, going to school, raising children, or any other normal activity.

Duhh October 22, 2007 at 3:46 p.m.

Duhhh me went to online Pheonix college. Phoenix is a bird that rises from the dead. I went there. I like birds. I have my pHD in birdies.

Thank God October 22, 2007 at 7:35 p.m.

Thank God for that! I can't believe they are allowed to even offer Masters programs!

Dr. B October 23, 2007 at 4:19 p.m.

Only you can address your own insecurities about distance learning. Most of the comments on this site are baseless..... full of opinions. You will have to do what you think is right for you.

Talk to some schools..... traditional and non..... gather as much information as you can. also... read research presented by the sloan consortium on distance learning.

jobs.aol.com/article/onlinecampus/_a/will-your-degree-have-value/20061006151609990002

jobs.aol.com/article/onlinecampus/_a/is-online-learning-for-you/20061006151609990001

www.sloan-c.org/publications/index.asp

Good luck with your homework! :-)

Real Dr. B October 24, 2007 at 2:50 a.m.

i see we have impersonators...... that's so weak.

IA GUY October 25, 2007 at 11:43 a.m.

Personally I dislike UOP, but there are a couple of 100% online I do like. This is a general opinion as a whole.

Now I am a product of distance education, and I am more useful in my career because of it. I will also state that there are good for-profit online schools, and there are bad for-profit online schools. I will also contend that there are good traditional brick and mortar, and not so good brick and mortar. The issue I have is the retards who lump all distance learning into one pull, then stereotype against it, then use the for-profit argument in order to back it up.

The bottom line is that all schools are for profit; the only difference is that, either the profits are disbursed to share holders, or they are disbursed in other ways back into the school. For you to better get an idea of how here is a good article about money, and the University of Maryland System, and how some of the numbers play into it.

http://www.examiner.com/a-940891~Living_...

The funny thing I see on these forums, is people defending their obviously biased stances on very little research based substance. Which is ironic since them seem to consider them the “academic elite”, which makes me think that they are the dumbest smart people out there.

If you look at the big picture, the for-profits, who are more accountable to their financial more so then any non-profit colleges. If any of them are publicly traded then they are even more so accountable due to Sarbanes-Oxley requirements, and they must also innovate their technology, and lean out their processes. They must also do this, keeping tuition in reach of more students, because if they don’t they loose consumers.

All of the “academic elite” are watching what these for-profits are doing, and are now realizing that they better get on the band wagon in order to keep their consumers as well. So for all of you “academic elite”, any one who has any street business experience can see this a mile away.

Now this argument is based solely on the comments made by the stereotype’s, regarding for-profit status, I am not including academic quality in the is argument, as based on my research its too early to tell, since total online degree holders need time in order to contribute completely into the academic community.

Just Wondering... October 26, 2007 at 12:30 a.m.

IA Guy,

Typically I have only posted on the Capella board, but your comments struck me. I posted this on the Capella board:

Let us be honest, my wife is a tenure professor at a respected B&M campus that has a limited online following. Her school is not-for-profit. But as she says, they are for profit as many other B&M campuses are; they just adjust the balance sheet to a zero balance at the close of a fiscal year. Money is given away; sports programs are funded, communities are given money, etc. Of course, a key difference is publicly traded vs. not publicly traded, but the competition is on for the revenue generator, the student.

I will respectfully disagree with you; I do not think it will be as long as one might think before degrees from schools such as Capella garner more respect. Through conversations with collogues of my wife and through my B&M MBA, most of these professors see it as a two decade project and by 2025 significant changes of the view of online education will have taken place.

Dare I say that several Tier 1, II, and III colleges will place much focus on online education in the next 20 year. Further, while the Capella's and the Phoenix's of the world may not exist forever, they are changing the precious landscape so many "scholars" have attached themselves to like barnacles to a boat for centuries. The real fear is the online environment and that for profit is merely a cover from this writer’s perspective. The justification goes only as far as shareholders and maximizing profits. Scholars continue to share these as the primary reasons and fail to actually conduct any feasible research on the quality of the education. This, my friend, is hypocrisy at its finest, scholars who live by research, but when threatened, run to the corner of obvious truths and fail to provide any further insight. END

At this point, no intelligent responses have been made, only gander and conjecture. Frankly, these schools offer an alternative that threatens the enrollment of traditional campus schools. With this said, schools that swore off online education just 5 years ago now offer online courses, certificates and degrees. It does make you wonder what is next when 2012 rolls around. If you search, even Texas Tech offers a Ph.D. online now. Yes indeed, things will look much different in the next decade.

Me Too October 29, 2007 at 7:40 p.m.

I am dean of a college at a well known university. I work a lot with other colleges and can assure you, none of us would hire a PhD (or doctorate of whatever) from Walden, Northcentral, Nova, Phoenix, Capella, or ANY for-profit in a professor position. The only circumstance is if that person already has a PhD from an accepted school that is not-for-profit. This is true for tons of respected colleges. The ones that are changing, you will find their staff all coming from those schools because other faculty will leave upon hearing they are mixed with these profit-driven doctorates.

Just Wondering... October 30, 2007 at 1:56 a.m.

Please read my Capella "Again" and commit on that board.

As well "Me Too," Regent university, a well respected school in Virginia (online Ph.D.-and a school that beat Harvard in the law debate contest in 2007) has residencies. Capella has residencies. Texas Tech has an online Ph.D. with residencies. I will agree with you, UoP and Walden do not have recidencies and the degree should not be respected as a result. However, if a school is making the effort, I think a little more objectivity is in order.

Dr. B October 30, 2007 at 3:43 a.m.

one more thing.... Walden doctoral students must spend a minimum of 20 days in residency. most students go well over that amount because they realize that it keeps them in tune with the university, their academic peers, and simply keeps the juices flowing.

Just Wondering... October 30, 2007 at 4:46 p.m.

No offense taken Dr. B. I appreciate your time and additional research and it is important that all of the relevant facts are available. The arguments against online usually cling to the same thing "for-profit." Beyond that, there is little substance to the argument and whenever I ask for more, I get the same one sentence argument and you appear to get someone who has no education impersonating you.

If you ask me, people like that and "Attention Fools" and his or her various personalities proclaiming that online-educated people cannot have children are the real problem and lend little to the argument that B&M campus schools are definitively better.

Dr. B October 31, 2007 at 12:15 a.m.

I'm crazy ya'll!

Dr. B November 1, 2007 at 1:42 a.m.

My head hurts, someone make the voices stop!

Da P November 1, 2007 at 6:16 p.m.

Da P be da place ta B. Yo Yo, check it, I be gettin da bling bling and be wirtin the papars like dis and day be sayin I be being one of da smartesd dudents. Yo, Da P be smilin on ye!

Dr. B November 2, 2007 at 9:41 p.m.

You gys have to stop it I have ben reding this board and it is getng out of hand now if I hav told you once I have told you twice UOP and Capella are fine schools and the learners deserv al the credit four tring there best to do there best and there best should be good enough becaue is is there best and you cant take there best away from there best.

Real Dr. B November 2, 2007 at 10:19 p.m.

ok.. this is so out of hand. impersonations? so childish.

Dr. B November 5, 2007 at 1:05 a.m.

Help me, anyone! My head hurts and the voices are talking loudly!

Dr. B November 5, 2007 at 1:06 a.m.

Now the voices are posting, what should I do?

He he November 6, 2007 at 2:37 p.m.

CG you can't write but you will be accepted to UoP, Capella, Walden, NCU, and other for profits. Its not about online education, its about the for profits people don't believe in. Its because you can just simply buy your education and pass without doing work.

IA Guy November 8, 2007 at 5:35 a.m.

Hi everybody. I just wanted to let you know that I am a fat dummy.

He he November 8, 2007 at 12:50 p.m.

Hello everybody, I am an even fatter dummy then IA guy will ever be. The movie idiocracy is specifically based on my life, and IQ.

He he November 12, 2007 at 2:47 a.m.

Hey everybody, I am a freak nasty wantabe gettin' down with the ladies.

Don't mind me posting about edumacation, I couldn't even get out of the 6th grade.

He he November 12, 2007 at 2:45 p.m.

My my, I feel bad, you really think UoP is a respected University. I heard they were applying for a lisence to sell used cars on company property, I mean campus. What a joke. You don't earn a degree here, you buy.

He he November 12, 2007 at 8:41 p.m.

Stupid UoP, only school that would accept us.

He he November 13, 2007 at 12:32 a.m.

You know, I come on here and try to post so that others realize that you are buying your dam degree. No one needs to mock people. Now, I command, much like the Wolves command the eagle along the river, you must stop. You must realize that in order to stop, God will not allow the eaters of fruit to come to the moon unless you grab the bag by the beans and scratch the cow before it dies from the animal goats who fill the city with terrible juice from ants.

Now, listen, I am a man who advises the truth, so please no that I howl only when I see things.

IA Guy November 13, 2007 at 12:39 a.m.

Wow, look at me, I am sickly obese! I think if someone just squeezed the fat out of my head, I might loose 800 pounds.

Mystery November 14, 2007 at 6:12 p.m.

Why are so many people against online education? Just embrace it, its the way of the future. Proprietary schools are also here to stay. They make money on education sure, but in order to make money, you have to provide a quality product. If these schools are so bad, they would go out of business. Think about KMart. Prices were high and selection was low. They are gone. This education would be the same way if the selection (or quality) is low because the prices are higher than other colleges. So obviously they provide higher quality.

Uhm November 14, 2007 at 8:36 p.m.

Uhm, is Duh and Mystery serious?

Uhm November 17, 2007 at 12:51 a.m.

I forgot my medication, could someone help me. I am a crazy man and I live in a van down by the river.

Why? November 19, 2007 at 2:39 a.m.

Sarah,

Why is UoP making your angry?

True November 20, 2007 at 2:17 p.m.

Good point OMG, this school is for bottom feaders, just like you pointed out. People that couldn't make it anywhere else.

True November 26, 2007 at 7:31 p.m.

I think its funny you defend UoP. What a joke.

what a bunch of November 27, 2007 at 12:44 a.m.

Crap! You sound like a bunch of privileged brats whose mommy and daddy paid for your education. I know plenty of Frat Boy Bros who came out of B&M schools more stupid than when they went in. Get a grip, on-line is here to stay and frankly mimics real-life working conditions (read 8 + hours at a computer a day and a lot of writing) more than a B&M does(read having your parents pay your rent and drinking beer-bongs).

He he November 27, 2007 at 12:43 p.m.

Its not about online and parents paying. Phoenix is more expensive than state schools, but at least people respect state schools. Phoenix is for profit and it is known to be the school for people who can't make it in anywhere else. You pay to go here, you pass so they can keep getting your money. Very simple. And links about Phoenix alumni are uselss. Of course out of 300K+ people some are bound to do good.

He he November 27, 2007 at 6:25 p.m.

I have a bad case of stinky finger!

He he November 28, 2007 at 1:26 a.m.

I am also respected in the porn industry. They call me "The Tiny Man."

Hey Tiny Man November 28, 2007 at 5:20 p.m.

I thought you were a UOP Grad...the stinky finger gave you away!

He he November 28, 2007 at 6:47 p.m.

True probably graduated from UoP too.

Love It November 28, 2007 at 8:45 p.m.

Love how this website mocks people. Lets take a gander at what people say about schools that are not-for-profit compared to the for-profit schools. Man, I can't find anything written poorly about Penn State, even though it has online degrees. Why? Your not paying to graduate, your paying to learn, and if you don't learn, you don't pass, unlike UoP.

Good work He he November 29, 2007 at 1:04 a.m.

NorthCentral is in the top 5 dope. They are for profit like UoP. You keep coming with subjective statements and you bring articles that mean nothing to the table to substantiate your claims. Personally I don't like UoP so I am not going to bat for them, but I will not go to bat for stupid arguments like yours that make claims based on bunk. If you truly are educated, your arguments are flawed and useless, much like your research if you have done any I am sure.

Love it, the website is a joke. Of course, based on the times He he and Love it posted, I am guessing (and likely I am right), you are one in the same. You can find poorly written statements about any school in one fashion or another, but that subjective material is gander and conjecture and does not equate to credible material that you can use to establish an argument. It is like coming to a criminal trial with only circumstantial evidence.

Now, unless you are going to substantiate claims with original and verifiable research (other than what this site, what select former students, or what select HR directors have to say), then you have zero to discuss. The intellect, including you He he, isn't enough to light a bulb.

Don't bother to reply He he or Love it, you clearly suffer from delusions of adequacy.

He he November 30, 2007 at 1:49 a.m.

You will probably end up in hell too if you go to UoP. Just an FYI, hell is waiting if you graduate UoP.

He he December 3, 2007 at 7:43 p.m.

Ya, maybe Harvard Online if your lucky, I refuse to believe that one. I'm also the Queen of England. Nice to meet you. Idiot.

He he December 4, 2007 at 1:17 a.m.

Mommy, it burns when I pee and my fingy be stingy too!

Good work He he December 4, 2007 at 5:47 p.m.

He he,

I see you were called out on your "reviews as sources" concept again. Sorry sir, but you cannot believe the negative and refuse the positive. If you only believe the negative, you must be a statistician, painting the picture you want everybody to believe with skewed numbers. Yes sir, you are a real researcher. You think from one side and refuse to analyze from both sides. Again, I do not go to bat for UoP or online schools in general, but I can tell a subjective thinker and one who lacks the ability to review things with a critical mind when I see one.

Sorry state of affairs if anyone puts weight into your argument, anyone with intelligence can see you argue "from the hip."

Re: Attention Online Fools from Oct. 21st 2007 December 5, 2007 at 3:21 a.m.

I just graduated from an online MBA at an AACSB accredited school. I can say that every single professor that taught every single one of my classes was full time and held a terminal degree. I agree that UoP is a total f**king joke and should be shut down immediately. But don't lump the traditional AACSB B&M schools with an online program in with UoP and Devry.

He he December 6, 2007 at 1:31 a.m.

UoP is ACBSP accredited, not AACSB. AACSB is much more respected.

Dr. B December 6, 2007 at 7:49 p.m.

AACSB considering Capella? I hope it happens. lol That would be so funny to me.

Interesting article:

www.insidehighered.com/news/2007/10/19/p...

He he December 7, 2007 at 3:45 p.m.

Harvard is also accredited by ABCDE, which is sponsored by Sesame Street.

Dr. B December 8, 2007 at 12:35 a.m.

oh my. now that was well stated. lol he he has done the same thing on the walden university board too.... but we don't really pay him/her/it any attention.

He he December 8, 2007 at 10:58 p.m.

Everyone,

My son is in 10th grade and has been causing problems on a lot of websites lately. We are looking at taking his computer access away. At this point "He he" as he calls himself has little to talk about because he has a 2.1 GPA in high school and is having a hard time even finding a technical college with interest in him. I have taken a moment to browse Capella, UoP, and NorthCentral University and my son has went by the names of He he, Love it, True, Being Honest, Fake, and Just a Guy.

This has been the problem; he spams several web blogs with his nonsense. I apologize for my son's incompetence.

He he December 9, 2007 at 4:26 p.m.

My pe nis is stuck in a blender. My God, I am a unit!

Dr. B December 13, 2007 at 9:06 p.m.

Nursing-Education Journal Gives Thumbs Up to Online Doctorates

An article in the latest issue of Nursing Education Perspectives paints a promising picture of online doctoral programs in nursing.

The authors of “Twenty-First Century Doctoral Education: Online With a Focus on Nursing Education” used a matrix of learning benchmarks established by the Higher Learning Commission and the Institute for Higher Education Policy to evaluate the online doctoral program at the University of Northern Colorado.

They found that Ph.D. students in the online program felt their studies were rigorous and academically challenging, had ample opportunity to collaborate with other students on research and form meaningful mentor relationships with faculty members through frequent e-mail and chat-room contact, and were inspired to incorporate new learning concepts into their workplaces.

Online doctoral-degree programs, which broaden access to high-quality Ph.D. programs and allow nursing instructors to pursue further study alongside full- or part-time employment, may be instrumental in stemming the shortage of Ph.D.-prepared nurse educators, the authors suggest. —Paula Wasley

chronicle.com/news/article/3629/nursing-education-journal-gives-thumbs-up-to-online-doctorates

nln.allenpress.com/pdfserv/i1536-5026-028-06-0332.pdf ORIGINAL ARTICLE FROM JOURNAL

Grad rate of 4% December 25, 2007 at 9:53 p.m.

I see the last reveiw has this stat listed. Care to provide a source He he?

December 15 Review December 28, 2007 at 6:44 p.m.

You all look at the December 15 review. The poster stated that UOP doesn't care about graduation rates...etc. He/She also said that there was just too much work and that if a student goes there, they need to be unemployed. I find a lot wrong with this argument.

December 15 Review December 31, 2007 at 4:46 a.m.

This is He he again. My organ hurts after I accidently stroked it raw last night.

This is the masked man! January 2, 2008 at 3:57 a.m.

This is the alter ego of those jokers on this board who believe they know all and anyone who attends an online for profit school is either worthless or subpar to other students. I will continue to mock in you oh so many ways until you leave the board, making you feel like half a man or woman.

In Favor January 3, 2008 at 12:59 p.m.

University of Phoenix graduates are definitely going places. Notice that the new dean of the school of business at Salem is a UoP doctoral graduate.

www.phoenixalumni.com/Newsletter/Decembe...

Me January 11, 2008 at 4:59 a.m.

Online colleges aren't for everyone. But if you are in the military, mid-career professional, can't make it to courses onground, it is a perfectly acceptable option.

Brittney Spears January 12, 2008 at 5:48 a.m.

I'm pretty and I'm not crazy.

Lech Walesa February 10, 2008 at 11:20 a.m.

*************
hahahahahahahaha..... respondants.. .I work in education too... if I do work, it's all but maybe 3 hours a day. Solitaire gets boring!
*************

don't be shy...you can count the extra 10 hours you work flipping hamburgers and cleaning toilets, too.

*************
I am dean of a college at a well known university. I work a lot with other colleges and can assure you, none of us would hire a PhD
*************

sure...and "another of you" is going to bring pokemon cards to your secret place in daddy's basement so you can trade

************
I am 25 years old, I own a very nice home, purchased 5 BMW's with in the last year, and I have very nice opportunities waiting for me to finish my MBA.
************

Oh really?
I squeeze watermelons with my b-tt-cheeks...don't laugh...I make seven figures working with a travelling show. Hey...wanna trade pokemon cards or watch Harry Potter?

Blue Blood February 28, 2008 at 11:38 p.m.

Look out's post is a copy/paste from a wikipedia article on UoP. The articles that he/she pasted on this site are antiquated. I know of UoP graduates who work for both P&G and Intel (the article stated that it may have to revisit its decision.... and apparently it has).

UoP is not a business school.... but it has one that contains three Colleges. You also failed to mention other accreditations the the university has.

Business degree programs are accredited by the Association of Collegiate Business Schools and Programs ACBSP

Nursing programs are accredited by the Commission on Collegiate Nursing Education CCNE

Master of Counseling programs are accredited by the Council for Accreditation of Counseling and Related Educational Programs CACREP

Education degree programs are accredited by Teacher Education Accreditation Council TEAC.

All of these accreditations speak volumes to the quality of education that UoP offers.... it must be in order to achieve 325,000 students? Duh?

Also, it's important to understand that UoP is not an online school. It is a B&M school that began offering its first online course in 1989. It was founded in 1970.

AACSB and ACBSP are not competitors of each other. Both bodies accredit institutions and have more member institutions than they accredit. Until UoP achieved ACBSP accreditation, it was a member of AACSB for many, many years. AACSB focuses on research whereas ACBSP focuses on teaching excellence. With an average student body age of 34y/o, what's most important? Learning what you can immediately apply to your job, or sitting under your professor doing his/her work for them?

Dr. B March 7, 2008 at 5:14 p.m.

Norman.... I am one of those graduates who teach in traditional programs. I have presented. I am published. And I make a very good salary.

Dr. B March 8, 2008 at 5:23 p.m.

That is not true. I am only 30 years old. I'm pretty sure that I've spent less time at the bottom than you have. My college internship probably paid more than you make now. I have done my time... including being an operations and HR manager for a fortune 500 organization. I have hired people from all types of schools. AACSB does not guarantee a better employee.

So what you say is of little value.

Joe March 8, 2008 at 10:23 p.m.

I'll be 28 next week but you get the idea. AACSB is the fast track...

Joe March 9, 2008 at 12:07 a.m.

Your TA is better qualified... your CV includes all of your higher education mate. You don't get to omit that. LOL

Thanks for playing, but we don't take forgeries here.

Joe March 9, 2008 at 4:02 a.m.

Haha... nice Alter-Ego Dr.B... whose the loser? LMAO!

AACSB is the criterion HR uses to weed through applications. It is that simple and anyone who worked HR for a Fortune 500 would know that. You're the one pretending to be a doctor on a blog... not me. I'm happy with myself and my AACSB degree!

Late

Dr. B. March 13, 2008 at 1:52 p.m.

Leah, I partially agree with you. In fact, there was an article in The Chronicle on yesterday that read that it is illegal for American doctors to call themself doctor in Germany. Unless they earn their Ph.D. in Germany, they can only refer to themself as Professor.

Now, to address the undertone of your message.UoP only offers practical doctoral degrees right now: Ed.D. DBA, DM etc. Some Ph.D.s feel that those are not real doctorates but they are according to the American Council on Education, DOE, and CHEA. I suppose we all have our opinions, which are oftentimes baseless.

Now, to address your implication. I earned my MBA from UoP, not my Ph.D. I also possess an extensive publication and presentation record. If you ever attended a professional conference in my area, you would hold me to a high esteem too.... or at least be envious.

But I say this to you....dearest complete stranger; how can you judge me when you don't know anything about me? The people who matter pay me, which is why I have a very comfortable life.

Anyway... enough of the soap box.

Be Blessed!

Dr. B. March 13, 2008 at 2:56 p.m.

I don't know you and you don't know me. If I knew you, I would have absolutely no problem directing you to my work. If I were to interview under you, which I highly doubt will ever happen, you would be familiar with my work. People who I converse with daily under The Chronicle know my work. But an indivdual under an alias on a board that does not provide personal information or a log in for security reasons.... you actually think that I am going to pinpoint you to my work? One of the journals has my face on its website. You think I would show all of that to you... a complete nobody? Get a grip, Leah. You don't matter!

Dr. B. March 14, 2008 at 2:04 a.m.

As I have stated before, people who know me know exactly who I, what I do, and how high my work is regarded in academe.

From your last post, I think you're just a disgruntled lesbian who broke her last toy and just wants to take it out on me. Don't blame me for your issues lezzi!

Leah March 14, 2008 at 3:53 a.m.

I retract the last sentence... you work for Laureate Education Inc.

USN O-6 (ret) March 20, 2008 at 7:21 a.m.

Looks like I missed a flame war going on between a fake doc and a lesbian if I believe you two. I read the Walden thread and believe Dr. B is a doctor... just not from a great school where he would want to share his works. Leah doesn't sound like a lesbian, just a woman who has been hurt by one too many men. You two take a chill pill and keep this on topic.

UOP March 30, 2008 at 9:30 p.m.

http://www.ripoffreport.com/searchresult......

More complaints, federal settlements. 16% retention rate, allegations of Title IV abuse. This is the very definition of a scam. But, at least it is RA (who knows for how long).

USN O-6 (ret) March 31, 2008 at 11:28 p.m.

UOP only has a 6% graduation rate coming in dead last...

http://oedb.org/rankings/graduation-rate...

USN April 1, 2008 at 7:31 p.m.

Lets add it all up. 300,000 students with an average 6% graduation rate. That is still 18,000 students graduating per year internationally. 6% may be discouraging, but the realistic picture is quite overwhelming in my view. Wouldn't it be worse if all 300,000 graduated?

*^^*&% April 6, 2008 at 3:57 a.m.

"Dr" B. is a fraud!!! Works the midnight shift at Circle K or for Walden (Same difference either way!!)

my2cents April 17, 2008 at 5:26 a.m.

I am just finishing up my last week for my AA degree in HealthCare Administration. The funny thing is I couldn't tell you anything about HealthCare other than HIPPA. All of my classes have been in Human Services. Axia will NOT give me a degree in Human Services because they said I was on a different version when I started and I would lose all the credits if I wanted that degree. If you look at the HealthCare Admin degree it has classes for medical terminology and I never took that class, but I did take all the classes for Human Services. I am transferring out of UOP and going onto by bachelors in another school. One more week and I am out of there! The classes were mostly good and the instructors were good and bad some do a lot and some do just want they have to. Luckily I got the same instructor for a few of my classes. My overall classroom experience was good except for the few occasions. The cost is high though.

Dr. B. April 19, 2008 at 2:56 p.m.

Why is there so much focus being placed on Walden? Walden and UoP are not in direct competition of one another. NCATE accredits teacher licensure programs. Walden has just launched its teacher licensure program (Jan 2008) and is making plans to apply for NCATE. See this link for more reliable information regarding The Richard W. Riley College of Education and Leadership.

UoP has its own wonders, including a teacher licensure program for quite some time. There is no need to point out one school's flaws in order to make your own institution seem stronger. You're hurting the whole distance learning/non-traditional education argument.

Instead, I think it's important to simply focus on the teaching excellence and applied learning that UoP is acknowledged for.

UOP April 22, 2008 at 6:15 p.m.

Funny mate, "applying for" accreditation is the tag line loser schools use. When you get it you can say something, until such a time it is just another worthless degree without professional accreditation. UoP has gone out of it's way to seek TEAC which is something Walden can't even do. They might not have had the opportunity to apply for NCATE but they certainly had it to apply for TEAC and they failed. This is where UoP beats out Walden's school of education. UoP also has ACBSP for their MBA, Walden doesn't have jack. UoP beats Walden hands down.

HR May 19, 2008 at 7:43 p.m.

I am employed by Boeing and graduated from BYU-I. I was admitted to PENN State online HRER program. They only admitted 45 students and all of the tests are proctored. With Boeing’s learning together program I could go any where and my tuition is 100% covered. I am in HR and I review resumes it really does depend on the school.

Question May 21, 2008 at 5:17 p.m.

Why do you spend so much time on these boards Dr. B defending your degree? Seriously, if you are "highly regarded etc etc" these boards would matter little to you. I came here to see how others thought about the schools, not to read people fight about what is real and what is not. I got my answer though, I'm not going to apply to any school that needs people to defend their degree once its done.

Dr. B. June 5, 2008 at 1:38 p.m.

I just saw this in The Chronicle this morning. Decided to share.

U. of Phoenix Reports on Its Students' Academic Achievement By GOLDIE BLUMENSTYK

The University of Phoenix is often derided by traditional academics for caring more about its bottom line than about academic quality, and every year, the annual report issued by its parent company focuses more on profits than student performance.

The institution that has become the largest private university in North America is releasing its first "Annual Academic Report," which it will make available on its Web site today. The university's leaders say the findings show that its educational model is effective in helping students succeed in college, especially those who are underprepared.

Freshmen at the University of Phoenix enter with reading, writing, and mathematical skills that are, on average, below those of other college students, but according to data from standardized tests, Phoenix students appear to improve in those skills at a greater rate than do students at other colleges.

And in a comparison of students who enter college with "risk factors" that often contribute to their dropping out, Phoenix's rates of completion for a bachelor's degree were substantially higher than for institutions over all.

Dr. B. continued June 5, 2008 at 1:46 p.m.

The report includes data on the university's degree-completion rates that differ from those found in national reports because those graduation-rate reports track only students who enter as first-time freshmen; most of Phoenix's students enter with some college credits. The Phoenix report shows that 27 percent of its students seeking associate degrees graduate, which is the same as the national rate; 38 percent of those seeking bachelor's level do (versus 43 percent nationally); and 60 percent pursuing graduate degrees do (versus 61 percent nationally).

But because the university caters to students who have jobs, have delayed entry to college after high school, have families, or have other characteristics known to contribute to dropping out of college, the report also assesses the university's degree-completion rates in comparison with statistics from national studies on students with similar characteristics.

In that analysis, Phoenix's results are far better. For students with two risk factors, the bachelor's completion rate at Phoenix was about 55 percent, compared with 20 percent for the national pool; for students with five risk factors, the Phoenix completion rate was more than 30 percent, while the national rate was less than 20 percent.

Such students "are much more likely to finish in our world," said Mr. Pepicello.

Diverse Populations

The report also shows that the university's student body and faculty are more diverse than those in higher education at large. At Phoenix, more than 15 percent of the 22,000 full- and part-time faculty members are African-American and nearly 6 percent are Hispanic, as of 2008. Nationally, based on statistics in the report from 2005, about 5 percent were African-American and about 3 percent were Hispanic.

The student population at Phoenix is about 25 percent African-American (compared with 12 percent nationally in 2005) and nearly 13 percent Hispanic (compared with 10 percent nationally).

The report is also likely to stir some controversy on another front: It seeks to show that despite the indirect subsidies the University of Phoenix receives through federal student-aid programs, it saves taxpayers money, while other institutions cost them thousands of dollars per student.

The report does so with an analysis—which the university fully expects to ignite some debate—that calculates the costs of state financing, Pell Grants, and federal loan subsidies but also the taxes paid by Phoenix and the taxes forgone to the federal and state treasuries from nonprofit colleges' earnings on endowments and gifts.

By that calculation, Phoenix officials contend, a typical public university costs the public $11,700 per student, a typical private one more than $9,200, and a typical for-profit college only $22 per student. By contrast, Phoenix officials say, their institution saves the public more than $322 per student, largely because of the taxes its corporate parent pays.

Leah June 5, 2008 at 8:34 p.m.

Why would Dr.B have a subscription to the Chronicle of Higher Ed. if he didn't work for Walden? I knew it!

Leah June 5, 2008 at 11:08 p.m.

We know what "club" you're a member of... Laureate Education Inc.

UOP June 7, 2008 at 6:46 a.m.

UOP is an above average school. It is certainly better than all the for-profits out there. It isn't Harvard by a long shot but it is competitive with cutting edge learning practices. I am sorry you had a bad experience working at UOP, but that doesn't translate into taking classes there.

If UOP is a diploma mill, every school on this site is one.

UOP June 7, 2008 at 6:24 p.m.

The only one baised here is the one calling us "jerks."

Josh June 10, 2008 at 12:42 a.m.

Let me first tell you i am now on my 3rd year and havnt done my first year yet, my first 2 classes went smooth after that it went to hell, the lates thas now went on a 1yr fight and see no end coming anytime soon. Our accounting teacher was involved in a accident, we had no teacher for week 2 - week 7, thats 9 weeks, we didnt get tests, assignments etc, after calling several times a day we all got feed some line of bs, each student getting a different answer as our class turned into a riot over the different message, answers and requests that we got, all of a sudden we get a new teacher she comes in and is as shocked as we all are, she granted us all a wc, for several reasons, both my academic and finance counselor, their managers all approved the wc, someone above them pulled the wc from us and gave us a F, we all contact the joke of a accreditation district which is located in AZ which they pretty much blew smoke up all of our butts, it was finally resolved with us having to retake the class at no cost if we do it within a month of the signed email, responding to that email saying thank you please sign me up, took 2 weeks to get back and im not scheduled to 6/26 1 month past the 1 month point, what a joke, stay away

JJ June 11, 2008 at 9:21 p.m.

The instructors were good, I had no problem with them or the method of learning. I did learn. The problem was that nobody takes a degree from UoP seriously. I want to get into a good graduate program, so I decided to transfer to a more respected university. It's unfortunate that their degrees can't pass the giggle test. Very sad.

Erin June 12, 2008 at 5:45 a.m.

How about this everyone that went to the University of Phoenix file a class action lawsuit against the company since we all got a half ass education that apparently is not even worth the paper its printed on. I mean I spent 30,000 and no one is hiring me. I learned more at the junior college I went to and spent a quarter of the money. If any one is with me I would be up for spearheading a big lawsuit for our money back!

UOP is a Shill! June 12, 2008 at 4:56 p.m.

How much you are getting paid?

Rod June 16, 2008 at 10:56 a.m.

This has got to be one of the worst colleges in the United States. I inquired online one time. After calling me about 30 times I finally agreed to enroll in a class.

Way to expensive, Horrible customer service, Poor teaching, too easy, bottom line I withdrew after one class.

They should lose their accedidation. they definately don't deserve it.

Matt June 20, 2008 at 8:11 a.m.

Hey everyone,
I have been reading everyone's posts for a while now, and I am amazed it is impossible for you to have a educated discussion on such a easy topic. We could accomplish a lot more if we were to actually listen to what each other has to say and discuss facts, rather than shoot down opinions. As far as UoP goes, it is an easy school hands down. I have been attending UoP for the last two years and I graduate in five weeks. Like I said UoP is easy, but it is also time consuming and I have learned a lot. I would not be able to complete the assignments if I did not learn the material. I have attended both a Big Bend Community College and Washington State University prior to starting at UoP. My employer actually asked me if I wanted to go to UoP so that I can work full time and go to school at the same time. They offered to pay for the whole degree, and they are even offering to pay for my masters. I can honestly say that I would not have attended UoP if it were not for my employer offering to send me there. Overall I am satisfied with the overall quality of the education. I have learned a lot. The programming courses were way tougher than at the other two schools. If what some of you are saying about UoP not being accepted by many organizations is true, than I guess I am screwed. I do not feel as bad since my employer will be the one who lost the 60,000 bucks. In the mean time I have already secured a great career in the field I am studying. I am making about 83,000 a year. It’s not as much as I would like to make but my wife and I have a nice house a couple of cars (not BMW’s) and we are able to do the things we enjoy. In other words we have a good quality of life, or at least it is good enough for us. I hope it continues to be this way. I do know that every situation is not the same for all of us. I also know that we should not discourage anyone from making a decision to educate themselves, even if it is just going down to the local library and grabbing a book, its still education. If there are flaws in an education system they should be discussed in an educated manner, not by shooting each other down.

rich July 3, 2008 at 8:49 p.m.

UoP commands no respect what-so-ever. You would be better off not having any degree at all.

Just a Guy July 6, 2008 at 1 a.m.

Oh, I'm scared... You've contacted the webmaster of this forum. Are they going to take away my birthday? LOL

Fully Accredited July 10, 2008 at 6:45 p.m.

www.phoenix.edu/about_us/accreditation.a...

Uncle Janko July 19, 2008 at 5:23 p.m.

I would never go to a school associated with Richie.

Just a Guy July 23, 2008 at 1:06 a.m.

I am obsessed with these schools. I visit several forums, blogs, and Websites daily to complain about online schools. I have never attended any of the schools that I complain about, but they must be bad because I SAID SO!

(*&^%(& August 9, 2008 at 7:36 a.m.

UoP Sucks

Positive August 10, 2008 at 9:05 p.m.

Man fukk everybody that has something bad to say about online degrees. They are the way of the future you fukking ingnorant biatches!!!!!

Steve October 28, 2008 at 3:49 p.m.

I received my MBA from U of P last year in international business. I was shocked at how many recruiters lost interest once they found out I went to U of P. To this day I still have not found a decent job. I tried several consulting companies hoping to land a job in international business. I did not receive one phone call apparently companies don't believe U of P is even accredited. I know how much work it was to finish the program. I can't even get a chance to speak with a firm. I graduated with a 3.9 gpa and still nothing. I feel like I wasted 35k with no hope being able to pay the loan back at this rate. None of my fellow class mates have found anything either. I warn everyone about going there and the problems they will face getting a job.

Aaron November 1, 2008 at 10:41 p.m.

I also received my BS/BM from UoP. Upon graduation, I considered many other schools to pursue to complete my MBA. I did look at UoP mostly for the same reasons I attended for my bachelor's; the online format makes it very easy to complete as a working adult. I did consider other factors as well and I think many of you are right on. You NEED to find a school that is AACSB accredited. That is, if you plan on having many options available when you graduate. I found Central Michigan University here close to home that also offers an online MBA program. I would recommend CMU to anyone seriously looking for a GOOD online MBA program. Yes, they are AACSB accredited, yes they require the GMAT, and yes, they are a great brick and mortar that has been around since 1892 in Mt. Pleasant, MI. Check it out if you guys are looking for a great school to pursue your MBA at.

Do I regret my degree from UoP? Not at all, but mostly because I am now in grad school at an AACSB school, but also, because UoP did a great job preparing me for written work. Many of my peers in grad school have a tough time with papers which are very easy for me after attending UoP.

Bottom line, UoP offers you some good classes, but I would not recommend if you are looking at grad classes.

kmgcc November 13, 2008 at 8:31 p.m.

I too chose to attend UoP because of the convenience. I will be retiring in 7 years and decided to take classes for my own pleasure. Yes, UoP is expensive, however, I do not have time available for a traditional classroom experience. My experience has been acceptable. Most of the complaints seem to be about business degrees so I would be interested in reading comments related to the Psychology and Education degrees. I have no regrets.

That's funny December 1, 2008 at 5:04 p.m.

Because I went to UOP to gain a degree in education and licensure to teach in my state. The courses were challenging and I had no problem getting placed in the local school disrict, which has over 40,000 students. My state is very conservative and I thought I would have a hard time getting licensed but didn't. I only went on one interview and was hired on the spot. I also earned my master's degree from UOP and it gave me a higher salary plus more respect in my field. I am a lead instructor and department chair. I also supervise student teachers coming from top schools.

There has got to be something you're leaving out. I find it hard to believe that no one would want to supervise a male prospective teacher. Something isn't right with your story.

The UOP education degree is regionally and professionally accredited. I just find it interesting that you went to what you consider an invaluable institution, paid tons of tuition, and then come on sites like this to put it on blast. The bottom line is that you still graduated from there. Stop embarrassing yourself. UOP will continue to stand.

... December 2, 2008 at 8:09 p.m.

University of Phoenix is accredited by the Teacher Education Accreditation Council. www.teac.org. There are other good schools accredited by this body. www.teac.org/about/index.asp

UOP is also accredited by these other bodies.

Nursing Accreditation — The B.S. in Nursing and the M.S. in Nursing degree programs are accredited by the Commission on Collegiate Nursing Education (CCNE).

Business Accreditation — All business programs from the Associate to the Doctoral levels have specialty accreditation through the Association of Collegiate Business Schools and Programs (ACBSP).

Teacher Education Accreditation — The M.A. in Education degree program is preaccredited by the Teacher Education Accreditation Council (TEAC) for a period of five years, from December 20, 2007 to December 20, 2012.

Counseling Accreditation — The M.S. in Counseling degree program in Community Counseling and the M.S. in Counseling degree program in Mental Health Counseling are accredited by the Council for Accreditation of Counseling and Related Educational Programs (CACREP).

Furthermore December 4, 2008 at 8:44 p.m.

ACBSP is a joke. Its not AACSB, which is the "Golden Standard." ACBSP is actually under fire now because they approved UoP. They had an enormous drop out because of it and are likely ruined. It was like the NSA giving Capella accreditation for its IT program. Its no longer respected in industry like it used to be. Face it, UoP - Capella - Northcentral - Nova Southeastern* - Walden - ITT - etc etc are a joke!

*-Exception as it is turning around by investing tons of money in research and it is a non-profit school.

Furthermore December 9, 2008 at 7:44 p.m.

Put together the links below to get to the page of the Chronicle. Simply search the Chronicle for University of Phoenix, or Ripoffreport.com, or just google it to see what you come up with.

ht tp://chronicle.com/news/article/4625/u-of-phoenixs-report-on-students-progress-is-disingenuous-critic-says

UoP is a Joke December 17, 2008 at 9:01 p.m.

If you want to go to UoP, just save yourself the time you would spend online and just send them your money. You will still get your degree and learn just as much as if you would do the work. All they want is your money. Money greedy Apollo group is horrible. Sooner or later they will buy ITT Tech too and they can all be one big happy useless family. Anyway to scam the government out of money and corporations will find it. Just like the welfare system.

UOP=SCAM! December 25, 2008 at 6:50 a.m.

See above statement, 99% job placement = SCAM!

UOP.edu December 28, 2008 at 2:41 a.m.

Awhh, you didn't get to go to the graduation? Then you might have realized total idiots are getting 4.0s. I only put in a minimal amount of work and carried that GPA along with a large segment of my graduating class. Everyone graduating from UOP is doing it with honors. What kind of BS is that? I hope you don't have to list UOP on your CV because it is more likely to hurt you than to help. No one would hire me for the very reason I graduated from there. UOP is about as convienient in academics as one can get, especially if you are the lazy team member who has your group carry your work. I can't tell you how many excuses I recieved from my group about how their uncle died or their wife was having a baby so they couldn't turn in their portion of the project. Looking back on it, I hate this school more than I hate the Cowboys and T.O. Terrel and UOP have one thing in common, they are both showboaters who can't deliver what they promise. UOP sucks, stay away at all costs.

UOP.edu December 31, 2008 at 4:07 a.m.

Oh cut the crap. I know it was you who posted going to Devry only a few minutes after you posted this malarky. You are a fraud of the first rate. You don't work as an operations manager at a Fortune 500, you work in an admissions department at some online school.

UOP.edu January 3, 2009 at 6:02 a.m.

Are You a Phoenix? Welcome to the new marketing ploy brough to you by UOP. Notice how they don't talk about how the degree has helped them progress in employment but that they had deferred dreams of ever attaining a degree and UOP gave it to them. That is what diploma mills do for you.

Congrats Phoenix!

I Love It January 3, 2009 at 1:54 p.m.

I love how every time someone posts something positive on here, the same dogs run to the bowl and start eating. It's funny.

I have a ? January 11, 2009 at 2:42 p.m.

Hello,

I would like to ask some current students who take the courses online how do you get the books and materiel's (e.g. are they sent to you via postage overnight?) Also, if there is a delay in receiving the books (e.g. 7-10 days) then when does your start date begin since there is a delay in receiving the materiel's. How does the college handle this or how does it work?

All comments are welcomed!

Thanks

what??? January 13, 2009 at 12:37 a.m.

I'm asking about how you get your books.

... January 13, 2009 at 10:58 p.m.

I'm not taking classes but would to know how you get your books. I'm asking a serious question so can you please tell me...how?

??? January 14, 2009 at 8:49 p.m.

I thought there was no problem transferring credits from one regional school to another. I was told as long as you attend any regional college that another regional college "will" accept your credits.

dimichan January 17, 2009 at 1:25 a.m.

Some quick facts:

No college is ever required to accept credits from another. Accreditation improves the chances since there is a standard to meet, but no school HAS to accept anything. That's right - your local community college can refuse your credits from Yale if they wish.

Which school you attend has nothing to do with how you filled out or qualified for, or were denied, financial aid. Federal wishes supercede school wishes - period.

There are positive and negative aspects to almost anything - trick is finding what works best for YOU. As I've attended a state school with a strong rep, a community college, and online school, I'm in a good position to say this.

Summarized:
The good, online. I have time to attend online where there's no way I have time B&M this round. I like the online books after experiencing bookstore hell. And I like writing and assignments vs midterm + final equalling entire grade. Advisor way more accessible, while that's not saying much, I saw my B&M advisors 1 time in 3 years.

The good, ground. Atmosphere. Honestly, for me that's about it, social and school atmosphere and someone telling me where to be and when. So we'll say more structured, and social ambiance/school "air" that you won't find in your living room with kids playing at your feet while writing an essay on business ethics in the electronic age. And possibly reputation if you go somewhere that has a "brand name" that's easily recognizeable.

The bad, online. NEED self discipline. A lot of it. It is SO easy to backslide and lose track of classes. Teams. Can be good but can also be a drag. While it's indeed like real life, it can also be frustrating. Reputation not up there with the "brand name" schools that are recognized by reputation instantly.

The bad, ground. Lack of resources. As I said, I managed with a 2 week window to speak to an advisor once. I was still confused about what classes to take. And I still wasn't sure I was in the right program. BOOKSTORE. Ever gotten the books on the list only to be told by the professor that no, he wants a different one? Go back to the store and oops? New edition, we can't buy that back - oh and we're sold out of the one you need. Congratulations, your home library just grew. For the mere sum of $125 for a book that'll never be used. COMMUTING. Working full time I do not have the time or patience to spend 3 hrs per week in a classroom 4x per week plus travel. Add in gas and food without time to go home. Maybe I was just unlucky, but at both my state school and the CC, I got zero assistance anywhere.

So far, I've done poorly in one class at UoP, my fault for missing an assignment. Done well in others and doing well at present, but it's by no means been a gimme. Material/learning is sticking a bit better with the breaking of the cram/test/forget cycle. So while it works for me may not be for everyone.

Curious January 17, 2009 at 8:07 p.m.

I have spent a little time reading through these interesting posts about the University of Phoenix. I am not familiar with this school so I wanted to do a bit of research on it. I turned to a couple of sources, such as the 2009 Barron's Profiles of American Colleges (28th edition; they have been ranking universities and colleges for decades) although I use U.S. News and World Report's University Rankings as well. This particluar source (Barron's) lists more than 1,650 colleges and universities. The source ranks the schools from "Most Competitve" to "Noncompetitve" and "Special" (mostly for working adults/non-traditional). There are seven levels in all. The University of Phoenix is not listed at all. Even Devry is listed (they are listed as "Less Competitive")! Can anyone comment on why the largest private university in the U.S. is not listed in this source?

Curious January 18, 2009 at 8:07 p.m.

Thank you for that UOP . com. I agree with you completely. It is not just the Barron's source either. I checked U.S. News and World Report (although it wasn't the 2009 edition; I haven't had time to get that one yet but I have a strange feeling things haven't changed) and found that University of Phoenix was not listed there either. In addition, and many of you know this, Oneline Education Data Base has some revealing statistics about the University of Phoenix. There is no data concerning Acceptance Rate, the Graduation Rate is 28% and the Retention Rate is 4% (44th out of 44 schools ranked; dead last). According to this website, the Retention Rate indicates the student body's interest in what is being offered by the college. They go on to say that factors that explain this include the administration's competence, quality of staff teaching, quality of the curriculum and the perceived value of what is being taught.
If I were the head administrator of this school, I would not be happy with those statistics.
I wonder what reaction individuals have to the fact that UOP is not listed in U.S. News and World Report (prior to 2009; I don't know about this year; maybe someone can chime in on that), they are not listed in Barron's Profiles of American Colleges (although over 1,650 other colleges and universities are), and their less than great stats at Online Education Database (website).

HA HA January 23, 2009 at 4:09 p.m.

Uop Sucks. They don't have a minimum entrance for anything. Just pay them. In fact, UoPs biggest competitor is Lacrosse University. Look that up and buy that degree, it will save you time and money!

Do your RESEARCH January 26, 2009 at 4:59 p.m.

For all the students looking into the computer programs offered at UOP, you need to stop right now! Unless you want an easy degree with no respect in the real world. They are Arts Degrees, NOT Science Degrees. There is a very big difference. Also, Take a stand against these horrible schools who just want to get rich. hopefully the end is near for all these pathetic schools operating like this!

Objective Opinion February 5, 2009 at 10:06 p.m.

I got my BA and MBA from the University of Maryland and decided to do my doctorate at UoP; it was a very tough decision for me. I chose UoP because of a demanding work schedule and because at the time I had a young family (at the time I had a 2 year old and a 4 year old).

Some people make the argument that UoP should set entrance requirements such as a minimum G.P.A and GMAT score. In place of not having the minimum requirement UoP has extremely tough and demanding first 2 courses that students must pass before formal acceptance in the doctoral program. After my first 2 classes I watched my class sizes shrink dramatically as a lot of students could not keep up with the intensity and the demands of the doctoral classes. I also had 3 residencies (for my first 3 years in the doctoral program) and I had to attend face to face classes for these residencies. After I completed my course work the dissertation process was yet another tough process!!! From getting through the academic review board (ARB), the institutional review board (IRB), formally defending my dissertation, and getting the dean to sign my dissertation it was such a gruesome experience. I can not speak for the bachelors or masters degree programs because I got both my BA and my MBA from the University of Maryland; I can only testify about UoP's doctoral program.

It is true that UoP does not have a great reputation and it is true that it may be "easier" to get hired if one has a degree from a school accredited by the AACSB. I will say this: I know a lot of people with PhDs from top schools who have not achieved much even after graduation. I have a close friend who graduated over 7 or 8 years ago from a good school who only published last year. I am heavily engaged in publishing and I have secured a teaching position even with a doctorate from UoP. I earn a six figure income and I have not had issues with my UoP degree. I will be honest that having a strong resume and other credentials is also very helpful. I will also be honest with you that most schools clearly prefer faculty members with degrees from schools accredited by the AACSB. You "may" have to start by applying for a few adjunct positions but if you focus on getting your publications in top journals you will find the job search a lot easier.

All in all UoP worked for me because of my situation. I will also add that I do not know much about UoP’s undergraduate and graduate programs (I do not know if they have the same rigor as the doctoral program) I can only testify about UoP’s doctoral program.

Message to UoP.com February 9, 2009 at 7:05 p.m.

UOP.com,

I think this site could (and would) be of value if you simply provided objective information without adding your negative commentaries. Your commentaries honestly make your input very subjective and you come off as if you are trying to discredit UoP. You are correct that there are definitely several concerns that anyone should have with UoP: It shouldn’t take a rocket scientist to figure them out. Just like many I was very skeptical of UoP. I can say that UoP’s doctoral program is quite different and I know this because I WENT THROUGH IT. As I said I did not just send in my resume and my transcript to get into the program: I took two courses, passed two exams (that are separate from the 2 courses) and went through a residency course which I had to take in Phoenix. I was careful to ensure that my program had residencies because I did not want a program that was 100% on-line.

By the way—I completed both my bachelors degree and my masters at a state university (University of Maryland). Though it may have been better to go a traditional university, sometimes situations make it tough for everyone to pursue degrees in class these days. Some people may have young kids and others may have demanding jobs.

As part of UoP’s doctoral program, students are required to go through 3 residencies. I can tell you that after the first year residency my class size was slashed in half (or less). Besides the doctoral classes, students also have to complete their research and orally defend their research. Just as in any other school UoP dissertations have to be reviewed by an ARB and IRB (very few students make it through these reviews---I know this because quite a number of my class mates are still struggling with their research) and then the dean also has to review and approve the dissertation. Students must also orally defend their dissertation.

Fortunately, I have been able to get a teaching position and I am heavily engaged in research. What really matters is what graduates do after getting their degrees! The biggest egg on your face is that I earn a six figure income and I am heavily engaged in research. I get e-mails from recruiters quite often; even with UoP listed on my resume. Though I will not just say that I am doing well “because” of UoP; I will say that even with a degree from UoP people like me discredit people like you who say that NO ONE can succeed with a degree from UoP. In an economy where the job market is tough I can clearly choose to consult or continue teaching and I am doing very well. Though I have chosen to focus on teaching and research, I get e-mails from consulting companies all the time.

PS. This will be my last post--unlike you I have other things to do than worry about UoP.

Curious February 13, 2009 at 12:42 a.m.

I understand what UOP. com is saying. I have been in academia for more than 25 years. Again, I feel that an institution's quality is suspect when they have no minimum entrance GPA for the undergraduate programs, no required SAT or ACT scores that I could find. In other words only a high school diploma or GED is required as far as I know. That indictaes complete non-selectivity to me. What does that say about the type of student that goes there? I don't think the GRE is required of its graduate students either. As I have also mentioned before, a comprehensive reference work, such as Barron's Profile of American Colleges (2009, 28th Edition) does not even have UoP listed out of the more than 1,650 RA universities and colleges that they do list. I believe that there have got to be better options out there.

Been there February 22, 2009 at 9:49 p.m.

I actually attended UofP on campus and it was a JOKE....I'm sure online isn't mich better. Mind you this was back in the 90's and I was told by several employers since than that when they see UofP on a resume they toss it aside. UofP is a joke not only among the students but employers as well. STAY AWY!!!!!

Phoenix Focus March 2, 2009 at 7:13 p.m.

Phoenix graduates are doing great things... even in academia.

aptimus.vo.llnwd.net/o33/phoenix_edu/email_images/AY/AY-6194/Phoenix-Focus-March-2009-1.pdf

Silly March 13, 2009 at 5:45 p.m.

"see UofP on a resume they toss it aside"

That is silly, I don't know of an HR department so incompetent that it would disregard qualified applicants. It is a regionally accredited degree, not a bogus one like a Warren National or Breyer State "degree'.

The biggest knock is the cost. You can get the same degree for half the price.

RE: Sheri Johnson March 14, 2009 at 10:38 p.m.

Hi Sheri;
This is "Curious". If you read my comments, I have to say you underscored my points. A degree from UoP will probably be in question constantly. Who wants to constantly be defending the validity of their degree? You are also correct in pointing out that they do not seem to have any entrance requirements for undergrad programs outside of having a HS diploma. This says NON-SELECTIVE in big bold letters and everyone knows it. Everyone in the academic community and probably everyone in the corporate community, in health care and in every other area of employment. Sheri, I also want to mention that I was an instructor at Penn State University before coming back to Los Angeles to continue my teaching career. I can tell you that Penn State is a wonderful school and you will have a degree from a university that is well respected. You are also underscoring my point about well respected schools actually costing you less for tuition. Thanks for posting!

UOP.com March 22, 2009 at 6:54 a.m.

"That is silly, I don't know of an HR department so incompetent that it would disregard qualified applicants."

Really? HR does it all the time. We call it "weeding through the pile." There are only so many hours in a day and we dont' have time to look each applicant over. That would take forever!

Dr. Leek March 26, 2009 at 6:57 a.m.

Universito of Phoenix wows me:

216.240.154.224/uopforum

paste above link into your browser

Sheri Johnson April 3, 2009 at 10:57 a.m.

Maybe you can try to convince yourself that "a degree is a degree" but, that's just not true. Does anybody really believe that a Havard degree is equivalent to a UoP degree? Obviously not.

As soon as I withdrew from UoP a lot of my friends said they were glad. They too had heard the stories of the UoP diploma mill where you basically buy your degree but, they didn't want to say anything to hurt my feelings since I was already enrolled.

Just because you have to do some work at UoP doesn't mean it's a good school. The issue is whether their standards are as high as other respected schools like, for example, Penn State.

The answer is definitely no. For one thing, Penn State actually reviewed my transcripts before they accepted me. UoP didn't even bother to review my transcripts. What does that tell you? There's basically no admissions standards with UoP.

RE: Sheri Johnson April 12, 2009 at 5:46 p.m.

Hi Sheri;
Its Curious again!
I wanted to mention that your comment about convincing oneself that "a degree is a degree" is right on target. Anyone who believes that is lying to themselves. In addition, your point about 'UoP basically not having admission standards' is well taken in my opinion. Just having a high school diploma to gain admissions shows no real selectivity. Therefore, it doesn't surprise me when you say that "UoP didn't even bother to review your transcripts."

Jon April 21, 2009 at 6:01 p.m.

I find all these remarks quite comical at best. Personally, I believe that the only person able to argue the validity or breadth of education received from an online institution is a person who has attended one of those institutions. How can one compare the education received from a traditional B&M type school with that of an online institution if they have not attended both types of schools? Any attempt to argue the points lacks substantive foundation and merit. I graduated with a BA History from the University of Connecticut, BS Accounting UofP, and a JD from Cornell. The degree from UofP more then satisfied the requirements in order for me to sit for the CPA exam. In the larger picture, the degree is not worth much more than the paper printed on. A degree only serves a purpose in meeting minimum requirements in order to seek promotions or start careers. Ten years after the completion of schooling nobody will care what degrees you have or where you obtained those degrees. The only thing which matters is the types of experience received and level of positions held. A person’s individual abilities and or incompetence will determine how far a person will advance in his or her life.

Right on Sheri Johnson!!! April 29, 2009 at 1:24 a.m.

Right on Sheri!!! People will ALWAYS care where you went to school. It will ALWAYS haunt you since it is on your resume. Penn State is great! Go Lions!

Jon April 29, 2009 at 4:31 a.m.

Sheri, I believe if your company was hiring a "top position" type person, then experience probably played a major role in determining the appropriate person. I fully agree that if you have two applicants with no experience (or similar experiences) and one obtained a MBA from say the Wharton School of Business and the other obtained a degree from UofP, then the person with the Wharton MBA would get the job. However, if you had the same two candidates and the only experience the Wharton candidate had was as a manager of a local McDonalds whereas the UofP candidate had 20 years experience working as a CEO/V.P. for 5 different Fortune 500 companies, then the person with the UofP degree would win out. A degree does not prove the ability to perform a job. All a degree does is get a person in the door or help a company decide when applicants have similar backgrounds.

MSUPhD April 29, 2009 at 8:27 p.m.

I would just like to put this out there. Phoenix currently has 300,000 students and nearly a half million alumni. I would say that at least 140,000 of its current students will eventually graduate from there. AT SOME POINT, the tables will turn. The HR and hiring managers of these firms who are currently discriminating against the Phoenix graduate will be gone at some point. And eventually, these positions will be filled with Phoenix alums who will then discriminate against the "top" schoolers.

I think all of you should be careful of what you say. Current and future Phoenix students will come onto this board and take note of what is stated on this board. They will be vengeful to your children and grandchildren.

Jon April 29, 2009 at 9:21 p.m.

Depending on the methodology, statistical information can be misleading. The OEDB defines the methodology for the graduation rate as follows:

"Graduation Rate — The graduation rate is an indicator of success of a college's students in attaining their educational goals. The figures are provided by the College Navigator database from the Institute of Education Sciences, a sub-agency of the US Department of Education. College Navigator defines graduation rate, for 2007, as the percentage of full-time, first-time undergraduate students beginning a program in 2001 who graduated within 150% of the normal time to program completion. (For example, for a four-year program, the graduation rate includes students who graduate withing six years of beginning the program.)" ((oedb.org/rankings/methodology))

For all you know, maybe only 4% of the students at UofP are full-time, first-time undergraduate students as required by the methodology above. If that were the case, then the school may graduate 100% of the 4%. However, since the website does not state how many students at UofP are full-time and first-time, the information is irrelevant.

Sheri Johnson April 30, 2009 at 2:18 a.m.

As for Jon's argument that experience counts more, that may very well be the case with other employers but, it's not with mine. The guy they hired is a regional manager who makes $220K a year so, just about everybody applied for it. This guy has no experience with our organization and no expertise in the area he will be managing ... zip ... so the learning curve will be very high but they obviously liked the Johns Hopkins degree.

Of course, this could just be an exceptional case but, even with your own example of both people having the same experience, the degree made the difference. Maybe it doesn't always but, in this competitive labor market I again ask, why take the chance? I don't see the reputation of these schools getting any better, especially as more and more traditional universities come online. The perception of the UoP's, etc. is only going to get worse in comparison.

As for the example of the Wharton grad who supposedly manages the local McDonald's ... even if it's just hypothetical ... you have got to be kidding, right?

LOL

Jon April 30, 2009 at 5:31 a.m.

I fully agree that Penn State is a better educational institution. As I stated above, I graduated with a BA History from the University of Connecticut, BS Accounting UofP, and a JD from Cornell. For a field such as medicine, performing clinical rotations is extremely important in gaining an understanding of your field. Would I want to go to a doctor or nurse who did not have the appropriate rotations or clinical experience, no. However, not all fields require the same in-person training.

I am assuming that since you mention RN/BSN that you work in the medical field. The Johns Hopkins is a great college and has a much higher credibility then UofP. However, as I stated above, education can serve a different purpose for each person.

Would I have chosen UofP to get my law degree if they offered it, simply no. I chose the best school I could get in to. However, attending UofP did allow me to secure the necessary credits in order to sit for the CPA exam. Is the UofP degree going to hold me back in my field, no because I passed the CPA exam and that certification provides additional credibility as to the knowledge and abilities of a person.

What is important is that each evaluates his or her circumstances and determines the best options. No one method is better then the other in every situation. I will state however that I cannot speak to every program for the colleges I attended. I can only speak about the specific classes and programs I took.

Sheri is a Joke pt II April 30, 2009 at 4:02 p.m.

Why would CCNE accredit a program that misleads? I mean this was on Phoenix's website.

As part of the University of Phoenix educational approach, your learning experience also will focus on problem-solving, active participation and teamwork. Depending upon the nursing program you select, your learning also will including a practicum or clinical component.

Students in the RN to Bachelor of Science in Nursing program complete clinical experiences focusing on community health, public health and nursing leadership. Master's-level nursing students complete a practicum corresponding to their chosen program. Students in the LPN/LVN to Bachelor of Science in Nursing program complete the same clinical experiences, as well as rotations in women's health and medical surgical, pediatric and psychological nursing.

Did you just not attend your clinicals which is why you are a dropout?

Sheri Johnson May 1, 2009 at 2:04 a.m.

My point is that accreditations only go so far. Excelsior College is accredited by the NLN but, that didn't stop the California Board of Nursing from kicking their ADN program out of the state. Same for Chamberlain. They're accredited by the CCNE but, they still had major problems with the Missouri Board of Nursing.

Accreditations are obviously a good thing to have. Afterall, Penn State has both NLN and CCNE but, it's not going to help the school all that much if they have a lousy reputation.

Sheri Johnson May 1, 2009 at 11:17 a.m.

UoP and other programs like it do give people what they want: a quicker and easier education but, that doesn't mean it's a good school. These are publicly traded Wall Street companies. Like any other Wall Street firm, their primary objective is to make money, not to deliver a good education.

The reason I compare UoP to Penn State is because the admissions process alone was vastly different and illustrates a lot of the points that have been made in this forum. All UoP cared about was getting me in the door and getting my student loans rolling so they could be paid. And a big part of their pitch was the fact that I wouldn't have to do any clinicals, that it would all be online and that it would be easier for me.

UoP did not bother to look at my transcripts at all. Penn State, however, not only wanted all of my college transcripts first but, they also wanted my high school transcripts. For them the priority was my academic record and whether I was a good student.

Once I was accepted, Penn State also pointed out something that UoP didn't: that I needed to file additional paperwork to comply with Dept. of Education regulations for student loans. Did UoP bother with this paperwork? No ... which is probably why they've been cited by the DOE so many times and have had to pay fines and such.

As I've stated before, if you guys feel comfortable with UoP and the way they do things ... go for it. Maybe you're right ... maybe it won't matter in the end. Obviously UoP works for a lot of people but I just didn't feel comfortable with any of it.

Watch and See...... May 1, 2009 at 4:37 p.m.

Regarding the last post:
Watch and see....Some UoP grad will argue that we shouldn't use federal standards to judge the UoP graduation rate. Maybe they would prefer standards established by mickey mouse.....LOL

Question?? May 1, 2009 at 6:07 p.m.

Just a question Jon; a full time university student (let's say a 20 year old)who happens to be living at home with his/her parents to save money and is a commuter is not considered a traditional student by federal standards?

Jon May 1, 2009 at 7:08 p.m.

Nope. I cannot find the one article that stated that, since no concrete definition exists as to what makes a traditional student. However, the following is a portion of an article by the National Center for Education Statistics:

The term "nontraditional student" is not a precise one, although age and part-time status (which often go together) are common defining characteristics (Bean and Metzner 1985). An NCES study examining the relationship between nontraditional status and persistence in postsecondary education identified nontraditional students using information on their enrollment patterns, financial dependency status, family situation, and high school graduation status (Horn 1996). Specifically, in this study, a nontraditional student is one who has any of the following characteristics:

Delays enrollment (does not enter postsecondary education in the same calendar year that he or she finished high school);

Attends part time for at least part of the academic year;

Works full time (35 hours or more per week) while enrolled;

Is considered financially independent for purposes of determining eligibility for financial aid;3

Has dependents other than a spouse (usually children, but sometimes others);

Is a single parent (either not married or married but separated and has dependents); or

Does not have a high school diploma (completed high school with a GED or other high school completion certificate or did not finish high school).

They also contend that this number will continue to rise as online educations and other means of education become more readily available.

Sheri Johnson May 3, 2009 at 8:23 p.m.

My question is ... if UoP is so great, why don't they get better reviews on this board?

Sheri Johnson May 4, 2009 at 1:08 p.m.

As far as the low graduation rate, this might explain why. From one of the reviews posted on this site:

"I am a former employee of UOP and as such, I can tell you that their main goal is not "graduating students", as they like to tell employees right from the get go. Its recruiting them. Hit your numbers or take a 10% pay cut. The incentive is, if an Enrollment Counselor gets a fair number of students to enroll every month, he/she is eligible for up to a 30% pay increase in their first 6 month review. This is no joke. Ask anyone who works or worked there. I worked there for over 3 1/2 years and I never saw any of my students graduate. My manager did not care about that. All he cared about was that my students stayed in class for the first 5 weeks so they would count as a "REG" for me in my review, thus making his numbers
look good."

Jon May 4, 2009 at 6:40 p.m.

One cannot compare the education obtained from UConn/Cornell to that of UofP. For one, the purpose of each institution is different. UConn and Cornell are considered research institutions whereas UofP claims to be a business college.

The sad and simple truth is that most people do not rely on the degrees they earn. A degree merely serves the purpose of showing the ability to learn and meeting the minimum qualifications necessary to obtain a job. A degree does not prove the ability to perform a job. To compare the two colleges is pointless and irrelevant.

Granted a degree from UofP may very well be stigmatized in the eyes of some businesses; however, when comparing the undergraduate degree I earned at UConn to that of UofP, the people at UofP were much more dedicated to their studies then those at UConn. It shows a greater level of commitment and overall work ethic to work a 40 hour a week job while going to school full-time, then to just attend school as many people who attend traditional colleges.

The main point is each person should evaluate what is best for them. So long as the education serves the appropriate purpose for the person obtaining the education, then anything beyond that does not really matter.

But....... May 5, 2009 at 2:37 a.m.

"Granted a degree from UofP may very well be stigmatized in the eyes of some businesses..."

I couldn't agree with you more. So, although job experience is the primary factor in being hired/promoted, where the degree is from does matter.

Sheri Johnson May 5, 2009 at 12:08 p.m.

Whether the degree, experience, etc. matters or not also depends on the specific circumstances. Yeah, I'm "only" an RN who makes over $100K a year base salary. It happens to be one of the few recession proof professions where I had five job offers the day I graduated. I was able to work pretty much anywhere I wanted. During this recession nursing has been one of the very few job growth areas in the economy while just about every other profession has been laying off people.

I mention this because experience isn't always the do all end all. IMO, the real key is whether there's a labor shortage in your chosen profession. If there's a labor shortage, like there is in nursing, then experience doesn't matter as much. And, quite frankly, neither does the degree. What does matter most is that you have the license to practice.

But a labor shortage is no guarantee either. It also depends on what you want. Like anybody else, I wanted to work for the best paying employer with the best benefits. And, not surprizingly, so did everybody else. Where I work, there is no labor shortage ... people are literally banging down the door to get hired so ... it's A LOT more competitive. Especially if you want to move up to the higher positions, where the pay is phenomenal.

So ... like many things in life ... it also depends on the specific circumstances. If I wanted to work for an employer with much lower pay and benefits ... yeah, the degree and experience wouldn't matter because they probably can't find anybody else to do the job. But that's not the case where I work.

Maybe it's because I work in healthcare or maybe it's just peculiar to my particular employer but, the higher ups like to brag that their managers have degrees from top ranked universities. Since they have more and more applicants to choose from, a degree from a top university has definitely become one way to stand out more from the pack.

But, of course, this is just my particular experience ... it could be completely different with some other employer or other profession.

Celebrate Nurses' Week May 5, 2009 at 3:04 p.m.

Walden University’s School of Nursing joins with nursing professionals nationwide in celebrating National Nurses Week, May 6–12, by recognizing nurses who demonstrate “above and beyond” service and by hosting two live online events with distinguished leaders in nursing.

“Above and Beyond” Awards
Walden University will honor nurses who have gone “above and beyond” with a $1,500 award donated in their name to the service organization of their choice. To nominate a nurse for this recognition, in 250 words or less describe how a nurse has demonstrated service to her or his community or organization. Nominations will be accepted at www.WaldenU.edu/honornurses through May 12. The three winners will be announced on the Web site during the week of May 17, and selected submissions will be posted.

Also, during the week honoring nurses, Walden will offer two live online forums. The events are free and open to the public.

Peter I. Buerhaus, Ph.D., RN, F.A.A.N.
Nurses: Why Do We Care?
Thursday, May 7, at 1 p.m. Eastern time
To register, go to www.WaldenU.edu/buerhaus

Dr. Peter Buerhaus, the Valere Potter Professor of Nursing at Vanderbilt University School of Nursing and director of the Center for Interdisciplinary Health Workforce Studies at the Institute for Medicine and Public Health at Vanderbilt University Medical Center, will present his unique perspective and insight as a nurse and a health economist on the new and variable challenges faced by nurses in today’s economic environment. Buerhaus maintains an active research program involving studies on the economics of the nursing workforce, health workforce forecasting, developing measures of quality of care, and determining public and provider opinions on issues involving the delivery of health care.

Dr. Geraldine Bednash

Geraldine Bednash, Ph.D., RN, F.A.A.N.
Nurses: Building a Healthy America in Challenging Times
Tuesday, May 12, National Nurses Day, at 2 p.m. Eastern time
To register, go to www.WaldenU.edu/bednash

Dr. Geraldine Bednash, executive director of the American Association of Colleges of Nursing (AACN), will share her insights on the impact of current economic challenges on the role of registered nurses. In her role at AACN, Bednash oversees the educational, research, governmental affairs, publications and other programs of the organization that is the national voice for baccalaureate and graduate-degree education programs in nursing.

Sheri Johnson May 5, 2009 at 10:51 p.m.

UoP charged me nearly $400 for a mere four days in the program ... basically $100 a day. Even though I was enrolled for less than a week I had to pay these exorbitant fees so there wouldn't be complications with my future student loans. UoP is not like other schools which give you a grace period to drop courses, etc. without any charges. The whole thing is a ripoff. They definitely try to sqeeze every dollar they can out of you.

The only good thing is that I got out early. I figure people might want to know what they're getting into beforehand. What we're talking about isn't new. Just read the reviews posted on this website.

Brandi May 7, 2009 at 2:03 p.m.

Can anyone who has completed their Bach. in Elementary Education from University of Phoenix give me any comments/suggestions about the program? Is it a good program to get into? Will employers hire someone with an online degree in education. I am from Pa. Any comments on how my license will transfer over from Arizona? What do you think about this online degree? Thanks

Sheri Johnson May 7, 2009 at 10:51 p.m.

I'll be the first to admit that enrolling in UoP was a HUGE mistake on my part. I wish I had done more homework instead of trusting them, which was my mistake and I take full responsibility for it. As far as late additions of course, I understand the problem with that.

But why not have some kind of drop period like most schools? Feel free to show me where UoP's drop policy is because they never mentioned it to me. From what I can tell, there is none. Not even three days, which would be reasonable even with the condensed schedule that you mentioned.

All UoP wants to do is to start charging you as soon as you get through the door. Then you get the ... "you should have read the fine print" remarks. No thanks ... I'll attend a university that I can trust where I can actually focus on the school work instead of having to worry about the school constantly trying to rip me off.

Sheri Johnson May 8, 2009 at 3:22 a.m.

You keep dodging the real questions here. Why doesn't UoP have a standard drop period like any other school? Even if it's just a few days? This is standard in the American education system.

Because UoP's goal, above and beyond everything else, is NOT to deliver a good education .... but to charge students as much as they possibly can. That's the bottom line.

Yeah, I made a mistake. I assumed this was a decent school like all of the schools I've attended before. Obviously, I was wrong.

Jon May 8, 2009 at 4:15 p.m.

UofP does have a standard drop period. Unfortunately the period does not extent to after a class already starts. However, since the school schedules classes months (if not years in some instances) in advance, students have more then enough time to drop a class before the class begins. I had to rework my schedule a few times and had no problems or additional costs; however, that also took planning on my part.

As for your comment, "they make money and placate Wall St." I believe making money would placate the stock holders of the company not Wall St. I believe the point to the argument is "YOU" had a bad experience and are trying to discredit the entire institution. Granted one bad apple can spoil the bunch, but then again we are not talking about fruit.

Really Jon May 8, 2009 at 10:01 p.m.

If Sheri was the only one that had a bad experience with UofP then why does it have a 6.44 overall rating? Remember, these are individuals rating their experiences at UofP. The 6.44 score is among the lowest of all on this site.

Really Jon May 8, 2009 at 11:16 p.m.

I agree with you that four days is not enough time to make a judgement. I also agree with your statement that UofP if "such a poor school...etc.". As I have stated before, it serves a purpose and allows many to go back to school who under normal circumstances could not. They are a RA university and deserve respect. I want to make this perfectly clear to you Jon; I am not a hater of UofP. My point was simply that the university has over 70 reviews on this site by "actual students or graduates" (I am assuming they are actual students or graduates and if you are going to argue that some of the reviews may be fabricated, you would be correct in doing so)and the average is among the lowest of all the universities. For me at least, it would be interesting to really examine the reviews and try to pin point what common complaints students have.
I know that online education is the future of education. UofP is a pioneer in this area; an innovator. It's founder, Dr. John Sperling, was the first to realize that the traditional university system was simply not meeting the needs of many. We cannot overlook these facts about UofP.

Jon May 10, 2009 at 7:11 p.m.

Brandi, UofP does offer refunds depending on how long you are in the class. If you drop the class before the class begins, then you will get a 100% refund. If you drop the class in the first week, then you only get a 80% refund. If you drop the class in the 2nd week, then you only get a 60% refund and so on. Find an educational institution which meets the needs you are searching for; however, a public forum is not the best place to seek advice, especially since most people have no clue what they are talking about.

A public forum is only good at explaining personal experiences; however, you should try researching published documents pertaining to specific school policies instead relying on the statements of those people, who by their own admission never read the documents, thus has no clue as to the refund policies. Is our society really progressing to that much of a point where people are too lazy to research things and blame their own incompetence and or inability to research on others?

In The Chronicle of Higher Education May 19, 2009 at 2:18 p.m.

Applications for "Transition to Teaching" scholarships and grants to provide support for master's degres in elementary, secondary, and special education at University of Phoenix's online or on-ground campus, in exchange for a commitment to teach three years in a particular high-needs school or district in Arizona, Hawaii, Nevada, or American Samoa. Contact: Adam Krisan at adam.krisan@phoenix.edu corptrain.phoenix.edu/project_reach/index.shtml

You're missing the point May 21, 2009 at 1:35 p.m.

Yes, teachers who teach in a critical need area can get a portion of their loans forgiven... but not all. This Phoenix grant ($2.5 Million)was granted by the US Department of Education and will allow a teacher to earn a degree for FREE!

To Actually.. May 21, 2009 at 11:25 p.m.

Actually.... you're assuming that 1. someone attends a cheap state institution, 2. that the loan forgiveness programs only forgive master's tuition.

Many teachers have loans left from their bachelor programs too, on average $30,000. Loan forgiveness programs forgive the up to $17.5K from the aggregate amount of your loans and are not limited to master's programs.

To Actually... May 22, 2009 at 2:04 p.m.

What data do you have to prove it? Because all of the teachers I know have at least $20,000 in student loans from their undergraduate matriculation.

Thank you Administration! May 24, 2009 at 6:01 p.m.

Thank you administrators for editing "Jon". Please continue to do so whenever he goes "over the top" which he so often does.We all appreciate it and now can get back to discussing the real issues involving uoP.

Jon May 24, 2009 at 7:14 p.m.

So I pose this question to you nameless wonder. Have you attended UofP or have any background for basing all your comments on?

@ Jon Part II May 25, 2009 at 2:18 a.m.

To answer your question; I am not, nor have I been a student at UofP. I have two colleagues that were students there. In addition, one of closest friends is an instructor there. If you have really read my posts, I in fact have defended UofP. I truly believe that you are confusing me with "UOP.com" or "tic tac" or possibly some of the others that have attacked your school. Again, please re-read my posts and look carefully at what I have said. I believe you will realize that I have indeed made several very valid points about UofP.

@Jon May 25, 2009 at 4:32 a.m.

You have to admit my points are well made. UofP was way ahead of the curve in distance education. I have been studying this area of education for a number of years now. I have read extensively about UofP, among other distance education programs.

@ Jon May 25, 2009 at 10:26 p.m.

I am indeed the author of those posts. If you wish, we can wait to see if some else claims responsibility. I will tell you now, no one will since they are mine. In fact, when you were having the conversation with others in this forum and I made my posts, I was a bit surprised that you did not make any comments then. You see Jon, five or six years ago, I became very interested in non-traditional and online education. I have research it quite a bit. It is impossible to do this without coming across UofP time and time again. As you know, the reason for this is the fact that their founder, Dr. John Sperling, was a true visionary in the field of education.
I knew several years ago that online education is the future of education. UofP is a pioneer in this area; an innovator.
There you have it from a truly unbiased individual. I have no reason to criticize or praise any school if not warranted. I try only to state the facts as I see them.

UOP.com May 28, 2009 at 8:41 a.m.

Teachers who teach for five years in a critical needs area rarely have more than 17.5K in federal loans for their preparation programs. How do I know this, I am an educator and my wife is an administrator. Most states have some form of teacher loans that are also repayable through the same kind of service and forgiven concurrently with their federal loans. My state allows 3K per year forgiven, add that with 17.5K of the federal loans forgiven equals a masters degree in any state school. The price and hoops I had to jump through with UOP hardly covered that but could have easily been covered at a state school. This token assistance offered by UoP is a joke compared to the amount of loans forgiven at any state school with state teacher loans and federal loans combined. At UOP you are inelligable for the state assistance.

UOP June 21, 2009 at 12:22 p.m.

is NOT an online university. It is a traditional brick and mortar with a really strong online division. Many people forget this.

An Offer You Can Refuse! June 24, 2009 at 4:13 a.m.

My friend received an e-mail from UoP expressing an interest in hiring him at $950 for teaching a 5 week course. They wrote that they expect their instructors to dedicate 20 hours a week to their duties. That would be $950 for 100 hours or $9.50 an hour. Needless to say, he went elsewhere to teach.

Why June 29, 2009 at 12:26 a.m.

Why would I take the advice of someone who cannot spell, who cannot use correct punctuation, or who cannot make a complete sentence? Also, you should check your facts before posting.

I don't understand July 1, 2009 at 6:06 p.m.

I work for UoP and my pay is $1500 per course. Maybe this was with Axia, the junior college of UoP?

Please explain..... July 3, 2009 at 6:05 p.m.

This question is for "I don't understand": Would you please give us more information on what class you teach and how long the session is as well as if you teach online or in the classroom (what city)? I would like to check your information since there seems to be a huge difference between what "An Offer You Can Refuse!" (6/24) states and what you have said. I want to see who is correct or if you are indeed both correct. I'm looking forward to your response.

@ I don't understand July 4, 2009 at 7:25 p.m.

The pay structure must be higher if you are teaching graduate students. Are you teaching graduate level classes?

It is $950 per 5 week class if you are teaching undergrads at the University of Phoenix. That is about $9.50/hr if you calculate the hourly based on their projections of 20 hrs. per week.

to Low pay..etc July 8, 2009 at 9:52 p.m.

How do you know UOP has low quality of instruction? Have you taken any classes? If so, through which model and how many...etc.

Low Pay = Low Quality??? July 13, 2009 at 6:17 p.m.

Does the extremely low instructor pay equal a lower quality of instruction???

@No July 15, 2009 at 6:56 p.m.

OK. I can agree with most of what you said. This is what you mentioned:
"....reasonable level of pay is fine"
So given the fact that UoP pays $9.50-$10.50/hr. based on their pay scales and hourly requirements, this would indicate that you feel that this is "reasonable pay"????

Oh "No" July 15, 2009 at 7:29 p.m.

What the hell is "No" saying???Doctors can be passionate about practicing medicine or a lawyer can be passionate about practicing law and they deserve to be compensated but a teacher/professor doesn't? He thinks $10 an hour is fine pay (retail worker's pay). I guess we all understand where he is coming from.

You People July 21, 2009 at 2:12 a.m.

seriously need to get a life.

BusinessWeek July 21, 2009 at 2:48 a.m.

Just the facts....

www.upxnewsroom.com/_downloads/PR_LETTER...

Low Pay = Low Quality??? July 21, 2009 at 6:30 p.m.

Low Pay = Low Quality???

Does the extremely low instructor pay equal a lower quality of instruction at UoP???

Low Pay = Low Quality??? July 23, 2009 at 5:25 p.m.

Low Pay = Low Quality???

Does the extremely low instructor pay equal a lower quality of instruction at UoP???

Low Pay = Low Quality??? July 24, 2009 at 1:19 a.m.

Thank you dd for the truth.
Who else please? I prefer to hear from current or former instructors. The rest is just hot air!

Low Pay = Low Quality??? July 26, 2009 at 6:50 p.m.

Thanks dd! I too was shocked at the low pay scale used by UoP. How can they expect to keep any instructor for any length of time? Here is what "No" said on July 15th:
"UoP's pay is not the best, but it definitely is within the standard."
I hate it when clowns like this put in their two cents and have absolutely no idea what they are talking about. Instructors/teachers/professors earn up to $55/hr. So UoP, with their $10/hr. is a joke. He apparently also thinks that teachers/instructors/professors do not deserve to be compensated for their many, many years of university study.

Need help? August 3, 2009 at midnight

Stats needs a tutor... his sample is not valid.. and his statement is totally baseless.

@ Need Help? August 4, 2009 at 12:52 a.m.

"Need Help" needs a psychologist! The average of 6.26 is based on 78 reviews. That is a significant sample. The sampling mentioned above was just to give the reader a idea of what the last 3 reviewers had to say about this school. In addition, the rate at which the school's ratings have decreased is accurate.

WOW August 21, 2009 at 6:20 p.m.

First, I must say reading this has opened my eyes about people. I thought the school was fine, but I guess not. I'm only attending for a semester in order to work and save some money, but you ppl downsize and criticize people for trying to do the right thing by attending college. I personally do not believe everyone who attend UOP is sub par and failures because I am a living example. I attended Central State University and my GPA is a 3.33 but the only reason I am attending UOP now, is for what I stated above and because I am from GA and Central State University is in OH, and im tired of the long distance. I would like to know how everyone feels now, some may feel the same but overall you never know what a person is going through or has went through so why judge them based on simple things like this, they may have children they have to tend to or any situation.

@ WOW August 25, 2009 at 9:38 p.m.

WOW! I can't believe how many mistakes are in your statement. There are punctuation mistakes, run-on sentences, use of prepositions errors etc., etc. I truly hope that you do not represent the average person going to UOP. If you are, it doesn't say much for the school.

WOW September 2, 2009 at 5:03 p.m.

@Dr.G and iamser, thanks for your informative and reassuring comments. @WOW you definitely must be a prick to count my errors on a BLOG lol. I didn't think this review were for a grade wow lol, once again like I stated before I'm a student who got accepted into a 4year accredited university and has a 3.33 GPA. With that being said @WOW my question to you is, were all those professors who probably have more knowledge and education than you make mistakes with my grading lol such antics, and as long as this isnt a paper that will be graded and as long as I know how to speak correctly in person I do not have to prove anything to anyone besides myself. THANKS A LOT @WOW AND I WILL NOT REVISE THIS!!!!!!!

The snobs are winning September 3, 2009 at 4:35 a.m.

For those of you defending UOP, Walden, ITT, Devry, and other such online schools, I beg this of you: PLEASE write like you have a high school diploma. There is a marked gap between the grammar, spelling and voice of those who are criticizing online education and those who are defending it. If you would take a moment to review your postings for simple grammar and spelling errors, your argument in defense of online students would carry more weight. I'm not suggesting Little, Brown here, just the basics.

WOW, there is no doubt that there are a lot of intelligent people at UOP. The problem isn't the stigma the students cast upon the institution, but the one the institution casts upon the students.

Dr. Ginuine September 4, 2009 at 7:17 p.m.

There is a lot of pettiness on this board. And as for "snobs are winning", he/she placed too many commas in the last sentence of his paragraph.

Anyway, whether it be Walden, Devry, or UOP, the fact remains that these institutions are preparing their students to be great professionals. Continuing to push dichotomies on this board serves absolutely no purpose. And I believe that downing someone for wanted to improve themself by earning a degree is totally foolish.

People talk about UOP's online education component, but no one can compete with it. Look at U of Illinois's recent global campus failure.

A few weeks ago, the U.S. Department of Education released a report that looked at 12 years' worth of education studies, and found that online learning has clear advantages over face-to-face instruction.

The study, "An Evaluation of Evidence-Based Practices in Online Learning: A Meta-Analysis and Review of Online Learning Studies," stated that “students who took all or part of their class online performed better, on average, than those taking the same course through traditional face-to-face instruction.”

Except for one article, on this Web site, you probably didn’t hear about it -- and neither did anyone else.

But imagine for a moment that the report came to the opposite conclusion. I’m sure that if the U.S. Department of Education had published a report showing that students in online learning environments performed worse, there would have been a major outcry in higher education with calls to shut down distance-learning programs and close virtual campuses.

Dr. Genuine September 4, 2009 at 7:25 p.m.

In such a hurry I forgot to preface the latter part of my post... it is from an article from Inside Higher Ed.

Kevin September 8, 2009 at 3:13 a.m.

It's hard to believe how closed minded many of these comments are about UOP. For those of you that are "educated" elsewhere, how could you place such judgements on the whole school based on 1 or 2 commentors who just happen to be acting immature just to provoke a response from you? Rhetorical question. College educated individuals should be more open minded than what you certain negative commentors are displaying. Don't have such a stereotypical outlook. I'm attending UOP and i can see that those few that are criticizing UOP obviously don't have anything better to do and have some kind of jealousy or maybe some deep rooted psychological issues. Never judge something or someone just because someone was able to easily provoke a response out of you by talking in ebonics etc.; don't judge the whole place or person based on 1 individual or 1 factor of any kind. And you "ivy leaquers"need to realize that the majority of people go to college to make a better life for themselves and or families, not for competition or bragging rights. I love my country, but i'm worried about the direction it's headed if people like you are ever in positions of political power. Just an example. Anyways, find something more constructive than looking for the best 1 liners to use when putting people or places down.

The snobs are winning September 9, 2009 at 11:13 p.m.

By the way, I'm finishing my degree online with National University. I agree in principle with Dr.Ginuine's appraisal. In reality, I've had two courses so far. One of the professors gave a numeric grade for each assignment and provided no qualitative feedback on either discussions or the paper, and the current professor provides excellent critique of both.

A professor I know who once taught for UOP left because he was being pressured to give unearned grades to keep students eligible for financial aid. His words, not mine. I have no problem with online schooling at all, but I have an intuitive aversion to a private, for-profit school. When profit is the motive, it is the overwhelming motive. The poor reputation of UOP isn't by accident.

Uop student September 15, 2009 at 7:19 p.m.

I beieve that all of you that bad talk any school is stupid there are people out there who really need these schools I am a mother of two with a 40 hour a week job and i go to uop
amd i talk to my teachers every day i talk to my counsilor every other day and i like this school and futher more if you dont like the school shut the hell up and leave us that do like the school alone if they were only out to get money who cares its not like its your money they are taking now is it

Thank you 'Yes Sir" September 17, 2009 at 2:49 p.m.

You said it very well. We are stuck paying off their huge school debt that they can't! There was a wonderful article in Time Magazine (I am pretty sure it was Time) not too long ago on this very subject. These people with sub-standard educations are entering the workforce, without any language skills or communication skills at all (as can be seen with 'Uop student's' post). Uop student has no right to tell us what we should care about or not.

The snobs are winning September 18, 2009 at 8:05 p.m.

Dear Uop student,

People come here to get a sense of a program. There are many programs that are equal to or below UOP in terms of educational quality and prestige of diploma. Unfortunately for UOP, it is by far the most popular of the mediocre degree institutions, so in a forum such as this, it will catch the brunt of the warnings that prospective students should look for a more respected institution aat which to spend their hard earned money or employer benefit.

You come off as someone who has pinned her self-worth to the image of UOP. You shouldn't do that, because it devalues you. Criticisms of UOP and its poor reputation in education and industry are not directed at you, personally. As far as leaving you alone, you are not the target audience for these reviews. You have already made a poor decision. We are hoping to dissuade other students from making a poor decision.

If you are almost finished with your undergrad work, I highly recommend that you take a couple extra courses at a real school to improve your written communication skills, then find a REPUTABLE online school to convert your disrespected undergrad degree into a respected Masters.

Response to Attention Online Fools??? September 22, 2009 at 9:03 p.m.

You posted: "If you go to UoP you are stupid and it is as simple as that. You have no business working, teaching or anything else. Just so I have made not mistakes, this includes ALL online schools like ITT, DeVry, Capella, Jones University, etc. Also, if you go to an online school from a traditional B&M campus, you fall into the same category. In conclusion, argue all you want, if you are to lazy to get of your butt to a classroom, you have NO business working, going to school, raising children, or any other normal activity."
And you have the nerve to call anyone 'stupid'. Ignorance is no longer a fashion statement, and this statement has not made you any cooler. I am a single mother, very educated and capable. I also know that the only way to survive in this world is by furthering my education daily. My parents were never rich, my college is not paid for by anyone but myself. I work full time, do not accept food stamps, welfare, child support, or any other form of assistance. I am not stupid by any means, I work hard and will one day leave my mark. Simply because I am currently attending UOP does not put me in any specific category, unless that category is 'slim options'. I do not float through the program, I have failed a course or two through out the past four years; but I read the books and study regularly in order to obtain the information and make the best of my money spent. I have witnessed stupid people graduating from any level of college, wealthy children whose parents have purchased their degree with the price of donations and bribes. You don't have to attend UOP to be a cheat or a fraud. I am not entirely happy with the program, there are a number of flaws within the system, there are flaws in every system. I seem to have considerable difficulty every time I start a new quarter, with the facility not processing information in a timely or efficient manner, but that does not take away from the fact that I have learned through these courses I have taken. When it comes to my masters and doctorate I will attend a different college, but for the time being it is working. What works for some, it not meant for everyone, but for you to categorize and segregate makes you and ignorant SOB. It is people like you who keep racism and segregation alive, by grouping one specific type of people into a prejudice and humiliating category. You don't know me, yet you feel you have the power to judge me. Who made you GOD?

Graduation Rates? September 25, 2009 at 5:28 p.m.

You all talk about graduation rates but look at this article in HigherEd

Chicago State University's accreditation is at risk due to "remarkably poor" graduation and retention rates, and other problems, according to a letter from the university's accreditor obtained by the Chicago Tribune. "There are serious questions about whether Chicago State University continues or will continue to meet the commission's criteria for accreditation," wrote Karen Solomon, a vice president of the Higher Learning Commission of the North Central Association of Colleges and Schools. It is rare for accreditors to strip a college of accreditation, and most of those cases involve small, financially struggling institutions. In contrast, Chicago State is a state university with 6,820 students. The letter noted that of those first-year students who entered in 2002, only 12.8 percent had graduated six years later. Provost Sandra Westbrooks, the provost, told the Tribune that improvements are being made. She noted increases in freshman enrollment and new efforts to track students who may be having academic difficulty, so that assistance may be offered to turn things around. Loss of accreditation means that an institution's students are no longer eligible for federal financial aid -- a disqualification that could be devastating to an institution such as Chicago State, which serves many low-income students.

Dr. G. September 28, 2009 at 5:19 p.m.

I like it... not many naysayers have had much to say about this study.

The snobs are winning October 1, 2009 at 3:40 a.m.

No doubt that online education has some advantages over classroom. I just don't think an "A" factory like UOP is representative of the best online educations.

Tic Tac November 4, 2009 at 9:10 a.m.

If you all happened to catch SNL they did a skit about online schools... totally hilarous. When you get such scorn on mainstream TV, it shows the reputation really hasn't gone anywhere.

@ To Tic Tac November 5, 2009 at 9:44 p.m.

You are absolutely correct! Having a group of entertainers sitting in judgment of educated people is completely stupid (as if they should be judging anyone). In addition, I would like to add that Tic Tac probably doesn't even realize that many traditional B & M schools (some Tier I universities) have online degree programs as well.

This new filter is cramping my one-liners! November 12, 2009 at 10:51 p.m.

I want to say to "@ To Tic Tac" that you need to lighten up a little. It's called PARODY, and SNL has done it for over 30 years." without it getting rejected It doesn't matter that they don't have degrees, that is not the point of the skit.

They aren't even targeting legitimate schools, unless you know of one where you can complete your degree in 4 months.

Everyone needs to laugh a little more. Take it easy.

Phoenix Tells All December 8, 2009 at 12:42 p.m.

2009 Annual Report

cdn-static.phoenix.edu/content/dam/uphx/about_us/publications/academic-annual-report-2009.pdf

Dr. G. January 8, 2010 at 3:18 p.m.

There is a more educated conversation taking place on The Chronicle, which deals with registered users. These fora include more professional and scholarly conversants who are actually qualified to comment on the matter. Most of the people here do not have the credentials necessary to substantively OR objectively weigh in on the issue.

I read the 2009 Annual report and must say that I am impressed. UoP has managed to do what most institutions have not been able to do. Transparency is important whether the news is good or bad.

UoP was recently herald as the bulwark of higher education for minorities... this includes ethnic and gender. 23% of UoP's 443,000 student are African Americans. Eleven percent of its faculty are African Americans... which is the highest in the nation. Six percent of all African Americans enrolled in higher education are UoP students.

Phoenix gives a quality education to those who otherwise would not have an opportunity. Instead of knocking this institution and its students, we should applaud them for their efforts.

@ Dr. G January 26, 2010 at 4:08 p.m.

You said: "Phoenix gives a quality education to those who otherwise would not have an opportunity. Instead of knocking this institution and its students, we should applaud them for their efforts."

I agree!!!! This is a university for those who would not be able to attend a traditional university for lack of grades or because of schedule conflicts.UoP serves an important function. It is all about giving an individual a second chance. I believe we all deserve a second chance.

To Dr. G. February 16, 2010 at 3:30 a.m.

While you have a valid point that this isn't a forum of qualified experts, your own argument is non-sequitor. The discussion does not regard the easy availability of degrees, for which UOP is certainly premium for minorities and non-minorities alike. The argument against UOP is that the grading is too lenient and therefore, the degree is non-competitive and lacking in academic quality. This is completely independent of the number of minorities that attend and graduate from UOP. Minorities deserve a challenging and actualizing education, and UOP is not providing it.

To Stacey from Dr. G. February 17, 2010 at 3:39 p.m.

Do you mean CACREP? There is no KACREP

While I congratulate you on obtaining your degree, lets be sure that we know exactly what we're talking about before posting. I am not trying to be argumentative but we must deal with facts. Also this is not a forum for advertising Capella.... because at the end of the day, UOP and Capella are all in the same boat. We must be objective.

UOP campuses had CACREP much longer than Capella... which did not earn the accreditation until 2009.

The Master of Science in Counseling program in Community Counseling (Phoenix and Tucson, Arizona campuses) and the Master of Science in Counseling program in Mental Health Counseling (Salt Lake City, Utah campuses) are accredited by the Council for Accreditation of Counseling and Related Educational Programs (CACREP). For additional information, visit cacrep.org. UOP does not offer these programs at all locations and via all deliveries.

My problem with Capella is that it was founded in the early 1993.... it has no history. UOP has been an accredited university for over 30 years. Other than its financial mishandlings, it has a pretty solid history.

All in all, you earned your credentials and that is important. Even more so, the credentials are working for you in spite of what others are saying.

007 February 28, 2010 at 8:09 p.m.

My experience at the UOP was great and rewarding. I would recommend it to anyone aspiring to further their education. I graduated with a Master of Science degree in AJS in 2007 and I will be pursuing a Ph.D in November from UOP,NCU,or Capella.
In my opinion; UOP is not for everyone, it's only for those individuals willing to put in extra time and effort to obtain their educational goals. I completed the program in about 2 yrs while working full time (swing shift) and not one professor ever gave me a grade, as a matter of fact, if I did not turn in assignments by the due date, the professor or the acedemic advisor would call me to ensure that my personal matters were ok. Therefore, I had better have a good excuse for not submitting an assignment on time or my grade(s) would reflect it. What I liked about UOP the most, is that some of the programs are designed to teach students how to work as a team and prepares them for the real world. It doesn't matter what your profession is, you will have to work as a team to accomplish a certain goal at some point in your life.
My advice to anyone contemplating on enrolling into UOP, do your research on the university, talk to the acedemic counselors, and don't let negative reviews from prior students who once attended the UOP or any college be the determing factor of why you decided not to enroll.
Lastly, have fun pursuing your education and career endeavors! Oh yeah... I graduated with a 3.7 and not a 4.0. so I guess I have to work on my persuasion skills! :)

j March 11, 2010 at 3:43 a.m.

You guys are so funny

007 March 25, 2010 at 5:06 p.m.

The argument is that you would probably have averaged 2.7 at a real institution.

Ms. Johnson April 15, 2010 at 9:15 p.m.

I like your name. Anyway UoP sucks.

Low Pay = Low Quality??? April 25, 2010 at 5:30 p.m.

Low Pay = Low Quality???

Does the extremely low instructor pay equal a lower quality of instruction at UoP???

Low Pay = Low Quality?? April 29, 2010 at 8:03 p.m.

Low Pay = Low Quality???

Does the extremely low instructor pay equal a lower quality of instruction at UoP???

Ty April 30, 2010 at 8:17 p.m.

hit=head :p

Oregon May 4, 2010 at 6:43 p.m.

I will be taking MS Applied Information Management from University of Oregon. The MS is strictly online. How is this different from UOP?

Deepthroat May 7, 2010 at 11:43 a.m.

Um....was Ray Ray's comment a parody of sorts or am I looking at the real byproduct?

HELP A STUDENT PLEASE!!! May 11, 2010 at 9:14 p.m.

I am having a real hard time deciding here! Like everyone on this post I have a very busy schedule but Online University degrees are not worth of any value these days. UOP was ideal I thought 10 years ago but now everyone including the guy who sells bananas on the street have a degree at UOP. I'm starting to question its value. What's more frustrating is it's really difficult to decipher which online schools are legitimate and have integrity. All online search results seem to come up with bogus sites that pretend to be authoritative, non biased but in reality they're just selling leads to their sponsored universities (should I even call them universities anymore?). Will someone in education please post which online schools that you'd put your sons and daughters to. Thank you.

D.Shadows May 12, 2010 at 6:49 p.m.

I have just started, but I think "Hold on a Minute" said it best!!!!! make the most of your education no matter where you get it from! I enjoy UoP it is all what you make it.

Ms.Gucci May 14, 2010 at 3:44 a.m.

LMAO @ Deepthroat.

LMFAO @ UoP.

PBS Show May 14, 2010 at 4:41 p.m.

Did anyone see the PBS show on TV the other night? The negative focus seemed to be on UoP. What did you think?

@ Shorty (aka Take a Short Position) May 18, 2010 at 5:45 p.m.

Shorty:

You said:

"Maybe you can make your tuition money back when this education bubble bursts."

The Problem:

The problem with your logic is that the 'education bubble' will never burst. If anything, more people will have to get an education in our society to get a decent job. The reason why this industry has been growing at an incredible rate is because people recognize this fact. What will certainly happen, in my opinion, is that the Obama Administration will try to regulate the For-Profits more closely. This means they will attach certain regulations and requirements that will need to be met before Federal Loans will be granted for use at a particular university (possibly such as UoP). I believe the PBS Show, 'College, Inc.' explains it very well.

The Bottom Line:

The Bottom Line is that you have taken a risky position that has been motivated by 'greed'. Greed and fear are two very dangerous motivations when investing. The 'Education Bubble' will never burst. There may be an insignificant decline in the per share price when the regulations are passed but there will never be a 'demise'. Think over your position. I have known many that have taken 'short positions' and have failed miserably.

By the way, I am no fan of UoP! However, there is a huge difference in the For-Profits. Some are very highly rated.

@ Shorty May 18, 2010 at 8:23 p.m.

You said:
"The 6% "gainful employment" rule, in my opinion, is a great step towards regulating the curriculums and depth of content offered to the students."

I agree with you completely. This is absolutely needed! I believe where we disagree is simple: you believe that there will be a 'collapse' or 'demise'. I do not agree. I do believe that they will have to 'scale back' however. I just don't think this will impact the company enough so that you
".... can at least profit from their demise." The more likely scenario is that they will simply make what ever adjustments are necessary. As I said above "The'Education Bubble' will never burst. There may be an insignificant decline in the per share price when the regulations are passed but there will never be a 'demise'." As an experienced investor I can only tell you that short positions are very risky. Be careful please! You also believe that all For-Profits are the same. I also disagree with that notion but that is a separate issue.

@ Shorty May 20, 2010 at 12:41 a.m.

You said:

"I just want to make sure that these grads have a fighting chance of actually paying off $30K-$60K of Title IV loans and maintain a quality of life that accompanies the obtainment of a degree. If they cannot land work, and default, then we all pay (with interest)."

I agree with you completely. As the PBS special nicely explained, there are too many 'graduates' from some of these schools that cannot and probably will never be able to secure work in their 'field'. The academically unqualified individuals are being turned away. You are right; we will all have to pay when they default on their loans. As you know, the default rate for students in some of these schools is double the national average compared with students attending non-profit universities. There are some For-profits (recently converted) that are B&M universities that have been around for decades. They are in my estimation very good schools. I use sources such as U.S. News and World Report, Barron's Profiles of American Colleges, OEDb etc. as well as personal experience and interviews of graduates from some of these schools. I have come to the conclusion that they are nothing like UoP!
In closing I want to wish you all the best with your short position, I truly do. I have never had the 'nerve' to go that route! :-)

Charmaine Allman May 20, 2010 at 9:21 p.m.

I pursued my masters program in business administration with the U of Phx in a classroom setting. The experience was great. I had great instructors. One month in my course, my job required me to be out on travel several nights when class occurred. I did opt for the online course due to that circumstance. I enjoy the in class setting because I remained with a great learning team and learn best when my resources are right there. If you're looking for easy, then online should be your choice.

U of P does however have everchanging advisors during your program. My academic advisors have all been helpful and kept in touch with me whenever I requested help or updates on my next course. Of my financial aid advisors, one was horrible. Their responses were delayed in days. It was frustrating to get a hold of the person. With financial assistance, the department does give great workshops on where to look for scholarships that are helpful. I received a $10,000 scholarship to help pay part of my program. When it comes to loans, you need to make sure what you're signing up for. I work full-time, have a newborn, a demanding husband and I managed to pull off a 3.8 GPA. If you're able to cover your expenses without assistance, do it that way. If not, only request what you need to get you through your program. Do not opt for the maximum because that will just mean more money you have to pay back.

Save Your Financial Life!!! May 21, 2010 at 9:43 p.m.

What I am about to tell you will save your financial life. No need to thank me. Just make sure to think things over very well before making a mistake.

I would like to introduce a little financial reality into the discussion. Let’s say you owed $58,000 in loans. For illustration purposes, let's assume a 6.5% interest rate (which is the average). In addition, let's say that you wanted to pay-off the loan in 10 years (120 months). You would pay:

$658/month for 120 months
Interest: $21,000
Final pay-off amount with interest: $79,000 !!!!!!!!

Many people simply cannot pay back their loans; especially if they are getting a degree from a 'university' which will not make them competitive enough to get the excellent job paying big money.

Think it over carefully. I would do the prudent thing and go to a community college for a tiny fraction of the tuition cost at a 'university' like this one. You can also transfer to a public university at a fraction of the cost as well. Good Luck!!!!!

Mr. Debt May 23, 2010 at 7:18 p.m.

Hi James;

What about the Debt you incurred? Will you be able to pay it back? As you know the rate of default on student loans for individuals attending 'non-traditional' universities is more than twice the number for those attending traditional universities.

Military...... May 28, 2010 at 5:41 a.m.

Add UMass, Gonzaga and Drexell to your list. UMass and Gonzaga are less expnsive than UOP (although they don't have mil discounts that I know of)

Ms Gucci June 1, 2010 at 11:09 p.m.

@Save Your Financial Life you are totally correct. Your best bet is to attend a community college then a 'reputable' college/university. UoP is complete garbage. If you guys absolutely need an online school check these out:
Western Governors University
Florida Tech University Online
Hodges University
Nova Southeastern University
University of Maryland University College
Troy State University
Bellevue University
Arizona State University
Utica College
Saint Leo University
These are the only ones off the top of my head. Please stay away from these for-profit schools. They DO NOT care about you. All they care about are their pockets. Have you noticed everytime you call your academic advisor, financial aid rep., professor, etc. they are always busy or not around for calls/emails? You know why their not around? They are out having fun with your money, taking trips to islands, going on cruises, buying jewelry that are worth more than our houses and many other unimaginable things. Before enrolling into a school PLEASE do your research first, you will save yourself some trouble.

Liz June 6, 2010 at 9:17 a.m.

I was shocked at how easy most of the classes were. I did not agree with "study groups" giving presentations each week in place of the teacher earning his or her keep so to speak. Several of us questioned this among ourselves. I had last been in a college class back in the 1970's and it was not easy. Now I was going for a Masters in Counseling. I was told that there are jobs out there and could make $40,000 a year and easily pay back my loans. Now 2 years after graduation and the beginning of the recession there are no jobs, I am working in dorms and fighting with Salle Mae because they think we can live on air and don't need non-essentials such as food, shelter, and clothing much less transportation (my car is a 1987), insurance (reqired by the state for cars), communication (can't afford internet so go to the library), and other "unnecesary expenses." After deductions for taxes, health insurance,and all the other deductions they take off paychecks I have a total of around $1500 to live on in San Diego. By the way I am 57 years old, widowed, and live in a garage conversion studio apartment. All they cared about was the tuition you or rather Sallie Mae was paying. When a teacher asked us what the criteria was to be admitted to the Masters Program we all agreed that the sole criteria was to be breathing since there were no tests involved and very few if any standards we had to meet. I don't know if they even checked my transcripts from the other 3 colleges I had gone to in pursuit of my AA,BA, and teaching credential, all state colleges.University of Phoenix? It got me an additional $1.35 an hour on my paycheck and that is it. I also got a lot of headaches over the rush job they did. The counselors are not advisors rather they are salesmen!

Ty June 10, 2010 at 10:36 p.m.

Liz,

The format is not unique to UOP. It's all the new rage in education. It isn't that the teachers are lazy, it's a philosophy that students learning through discussions and projects among themselves develop better than traditional lecture students. My Gonzaga MA is run very much the same way, except without the groups allowing students who shouldn't be there sucking grades off the ones who are really puttng themselves into it.

Where UOP falls off is that their grading standard for what you've learned is laughably lenient.

James June 18, 2010 at 3 a.m.

@Mr. Debt,
I will have my loans paid off within 4 years. I will have to postpone a new BMW for a few years though. My new job is great and I am earning 3 times as much now with my degree from UoP. Eduacation is a wonderful investment and I am so much more happier with my new career. I'm glad I went for it and was not deterred.

Mr. Debt June 19, 2010 at 4:53 p.m.

What I am about to tell you will save your financial life. No need to thank me. Just make sure to think things over very well before making a mistake.

I would like to introduce a little financial reality into the discussion. Let’s say you owed $58,000 in loans. For illustration purposes, let's assume a 6.5% interest rate (which is the average). In addition, let's say that you wanted to pay-off the loan in 10 years (120 months). You would pay:

$658/month for 120 months
Interest: $21,000
Final pay-off amount with interest: $79,000 !!!!!!!!

Many people simply cannot pay back their loans; especially if they are getting a degree from a 'university' which will not make them competitive enough to get the excellent job paying big money.

Think it over carefully. I would do the prudent thing and go to a community college for a tiny fraction of the tuition cost at a 'university' like this one. You can also transfer to a public university at a fraction of the cost as well. Good Luck!!!!!

Save Your Financial Life!!! July 4, 2010 at 10:06 p.m.

What I am about to tell you will save your financial life. No need to thank me. Just make sure to think things over very well before making a mistake.

I would like to introduce a little financial reality into the discussion. Let’s say you owed $58,000 in loans. For illustration purposes, let's assume a 6.5% interest rate (which is the average). In addition, let's say that you wanted to pay-off the loan in 10 years (120 months). You would pay:

$658/month for 120 months
Interest: $21,000
Final pay-off amount with interest: $79,000 !!!!!!!!

Many people simply cannot pay back their loans; especially if they are getting a degree from a 'university' which will not make them competitive enough to get the excellent job paying big money.

Think it over carefully. I would do the prudent thing and go to a community college for a tiny fraction of the tuition cost at a 'university' like this one. You can also transfer to a public university at a fraction of the cost as well. Good Luck!!!!!

Army Chic July 10, 2010 at 2:47 p.m.

There are many things on this post that make sense and a lot of things that are completely unfair. I suppose I am the type that really is not biased to either side but rather the type that thinks that education in general is truly what you and you alone make of it. I know of people who never went past high school who are leading comfortable and some more than comfortable lifestyles. Then there are a couple people that I know who both have recently acquired Master's degrees and one is working at a Wal-Mart, and the other is a proud employee at a local Exxon. I'm not saying that I'm the smartest girl in the world or that I have all the answers, but I will say that in my personal experience that no one thing should be talked down about unless you are the one with the bad experience from it. Even then, that is YOUR experience, not every one's. And as for the people who seem to think that if you didn't go to a traditional brick and mortar school that you have an I.Q. of 3 and and have no right to breathe, I say, you made you fit to judge? If your revered school that you came from taught you that then that is not an education that I want. I feel that fairness is necessary in a forum such as this. Maybe not everyone can fit that tradition mold that some of you speak of. Personally, I can relate to both sides. I am a young sergeant in the Army with a small at-home design business all of which I attained with only a school education and a few online classes under my belt. However I am currently attending a community college, not because I believe in so much of what anyone has said on here, but because my ultimate goal is to become an LPN which is more geared toward the type of learner I am. Truly I am not biased even if it may come across like I am. The focus of my message is basically directed at the people who seem to be so anti-online education because I really haven't seen any biased posts for people who are pro-online education. But to all of you I say, make the most out of whatever you decide to do and know that NONE of us are fit to judge since people seem to want to take it there.

Army Chic July 10, 2010 at 7:37 p.m.

School is something that has to be able to fit into your lifestyle. Fortunately or unfortunately, some people have a lot more in their lives to juggle school into than others. I commend anyone who tries to better themselves no matter where they find that success from. I agree with Ms. Gucci that there are some schools that are not worthy of the accreditation that they have been granted and that goes for both online and traditional schools. It's the same concept as someone dealing with a car or a house. When looking for a good fit as far as schools go, you have to do your reasearch. I seriously think that there are good schools on both sides of the spectrum but just like with anything, sometimes you have to weed out the bad to get to the good. As for this school, I've sure there are horror stories as well as successes, but ultimately the potential student has to be willing to do the reasearch on the school to get a truly unbiased opinion. Only then will you get the specific answer you are looking for as to whether or not this or any other school is for you. Best of luck to everyone and getting to their goals and dreams and whatever paths they may lead you on!

From a former Instructor July 20, 2010 at 5:16 p.m.

Here is what a former UoP instructor wrote a year ago:

dd July 25, 2009 at 2:52 a.m.

"I was teaching graduate students and getting $1200 for a 6 week course. Again, UoP expects their instructors to spend 20 hours each week working for them. So here we go

6 weeks*20 hours= 120 hours/$1200-----so I was getting paid $10/hour for teaching a class with 23 grad students when I have an MS degree."

This university pays the absolute lowest of any of the universities that I have researched. Even Grantham pays $15/hr.

Ex-Faculty August 7, 2010 at 8:09 a.m.

I have taught at many online schools, but UoP is not one to consider. Apollo is all about making money, people be damned. That includes students and faculty. Adjuncts get paid nothing while students are charged out the ass. 98% of all UoP faculty are adjuncts and 95% of those have full time jobs. Most of those with families to deal with. They do not have time to deal with students nor do they get paid enough to care. Apollo spends more money on advertising than they do on the students of UoP and the other plethora of schools they run. They even offer campuses in third world countries. Seriously avoid this money pit at all costs, you do not need the stain of UoP on your CV.

UOP Instructor August 9, 2010 at 5:40 p.m.

Regarding the pay for UOP faculty: The expectation is NOT 20 hours per week. The expectation is about 10 hours per week. I know...I'm an instructor and have been for 9 years.

Therefore, for a beginning instructor of a 5-week course:

$950 \5 weeks = 190 per week \ 10 hours = $19 per hour.

Perhaps not a great income, but it is part-time work. Instructors are required to have full-time jobs in their field of expertise.

If you get into teaching for money, you are going to be sadly disappointed no matter where you go.

Ex-Faculty August 11, 2010 at 6:53 p.m.

"Anyone get a chance to read the GAO report and findings concerning Apollo (UoP) among others (namely Kaplan U. and Corinthian/Everest)? It is an eye opener!!!"

I didn't read it, but I watched the GAO videos of their undercover operation. Now that was an eye opener... talk about FRAUD!

Clearly This is Funny August 13, 2010 at 5:42 p.m.

HA HA, just add the ww w to the link.

forbes.com/2010/08/01/higher-education-student-debt-opinions-best-colleges-10-harkin.html

Tammy August 14, 2010 at 12:37 p.m.

More traditional schools with online courses and/or programs.

Louisiana
Baton Rouge Community College
Bossier Parish Community College
CALL
Delgado Community College
Grambling State University
Louisiana State University and A & M College
Louisiana State University, Alexandria
Louisiana State University, Eunice
Louisiana State University, Health Sciences Center, New Orleans
Louisiana State University, Shreveport
Louisiana Tech University
McNeese State University
Nicholls State University
Northwestern State University
Nunez Community College
River Parishes Community College
South Louisiana Community College
Southeastern Louisiana University
Southern University and A&M College
Southern University at New Orleans
Southern University at Shreveport
University of Louisiana at Lafayette
University of Louisiana at Monroe
University of New Orleans

Maryland
Anne Arundel Community College
Capitol College
College of Southern Maryland
Morgan State University
Towson University
University of Baltimore
University of Maryland Baltimore
University of Maryland Baltimore County

Mississippi
Alcorn State University, Natchez Campus
Coahoma Community College
Mississippi State University
Mississippi University for Women
Mississippi Valley State University
University of Southern Mississippi

North Carolina
Alamance Community College
Central Carolina Community College
Cleveland Community College
Coastal Carolina Community College, NC
Durham Technical Community College
East Carolina University
Elizabeth City State University
Fayetteville Technical Community College
Haywood Community College
North Carolina State University
Pitt Community College
Randolph Community College
University of North Carolina, Charlotte
University of North Carolina, Pembroke
Western Carolina University

Oklahoma
Cameron University
Northwestern Oklahoma State University
Oklahoma Panhandle State University
Oklahoma State University, Oklahoma City
Oklahoma State University, Stillwater
Rogers State University
Southeastern Oklahoma State University
University of Central Oklahoma

South Carolina
Clemson University
Limestone College
Medical University of South Carolina
Piedmont Technical College
University of South Carolina, Aiken
University of South Carolina, Columbia
University of South Carolina, Upstate
York Technical College

Tennessee
Austin Peay State University
East Tennessee State University
Middle Tennessee State University
Pellissippi State Community College
Tennessee Regents Online Degree Programs
Tennessee State University
Tennessee Technological University
The University of Memphis
University of Tennessee, Health Science Center, Memphis
University of Tennessee, Knoxville
University of Tennessee, Martin
University of Tennessee, Space Institute

Tammy August 14, 2010 at 12:38 p.m.

Obviously, this is just the South, so just imagine how many non-profit schools across the country offer online courses and/or programs.

Bad reputation August 15, 2010 at 4:03 p.m.

This school has an awful reputation. It advertises like its Coke or Tide or McDonalds. The business world laughs at this school (half of them invest in UoP to make money).

The education is a joke. It is a slaughter house mentality. It wants you to enroll in it's crap education to make money, that's it. Why doesn't this school apply for the gold standard business accreditation (AASCB)? Because that would cost money, and the shareholders wouldn't here of it.

Buyer beware. BTW it's being investigated by the Dept of Education and Congress for unethical practices (this of course will end when the lobbyists hired by UoP pay off everyone to stop the investigation)

Charles August 17, 2010 at 7:21 p.m.

Tammy, You put the same postings on reviews to Strayer University. Are you posting about all the online schools? I'm just curious.

@Charles August 18, 2010 at 8:24 a.m.

I can only speak from personal experience about the schools I attended (UoP, WIU, CTU, and CTC). I just got tired of seeing people say they had no other choice. In most cases, not only were there plenty of other for-profit colleges that were much cheaper, but there were also plenty of traditional colleges with online programs. There are even traditional schools that have been providing distance education programs longer than UoP and do a much better job at it.

In don't know about now, but in 2005/2006, UoP's math classes were on the middle school level. When I complained, they boasted about the classes being at the community college level.

Legal issues Apollo Group has faced or is facing:

Apollo Group is now required to post a letter of credit with the government because of loan return rates.

Apollo Group lost a lawsuit over them paying commission to admissions counselors which is in violation of the Higher Education Act.

A lawsuit was reinstated claiming that the Apollo Group lied to stockholders by withholding information about the violation of the Higher Education Act. Apollo could go bankrupt if they have to pay back the money lost by stockholders.

UoP paid a fine for not meeting instructional hour requirements.

UoP was fined for not promptly returning loans and grants.

UoP is lucky that the plaintiffs in a class action lawsuit decided not to go through with it, but another one is pending. The lawsuit is concerning the wrongful return of student loans in order to keep their default rates down. The school would rather force the students to pay out of pocket when they withdraw instead of having them possibly default on the loans. Default rates beyond a certain point disqualifies a school from receiving Title IV funding.

UoP settled with the Department of Labor for EEOC violations.

Did I mention that UoP admitted me without asking for a high school or GED transcript? Schools with open enrollment also admit people with mental disabilities, but they don't care, because the government is paying for it.

My coworker who is almost finished with his information technology program has learned very little about the subject because all he does is write papers about irrelevant topics. I had a coworker who graduated from Kaplan and got a job at AT&T that doesn't even require a degree.

Tammy August 20, 2010 at 1:41 p.m.

I agree, not every school (for-profit or not-for-profit) has all of the programmatic accreditations out there.

full time student and full time employee August 21, 2010 at 6:54 p.m.

I am going to the university, and I have already applied for several postions. All applications were accepted and are waiting for further credits. I only need a few before I will be accepted to teach where I want to. For me as a full time mom, student and employee, I do not have the time to go to a traditional school because I dont qualify for funding for childcare. I can only hope my degree takes me somewhere. If it does not, and in the contract that i signed, it states that if my degree is not recognized, then all my money will be refunded. I had this taken up to tigard and notarized while my financial counselor signed it as well.
Point being, legally, cover your butts. Education is what you make it. I fully inted to teach once i graduate. Life is all about making mistakes to learn new stuff. Those are MY mistakes, and not one has the right to tell me I told you so.
For all of you being mean about the subject, you all have your own opinions. However I dont think pushing them onto other people is what we should all be doing. Lend your experience and respect will follow.
If there are any teachers out there who attended U of P please reply so we can all see if the proof is in the pudding.

UCLA GRAD (pheww!) August 23, 2010 at 4:12 a.m.

My friend just graduated from there and since they contract out their professors, when my friend tried to get a letter of rec to apply at Cal State LA, they wouldn't give her one on letterhead. The professor didn't have access to the letterhead. So she didn't get into the program at CalState for that reason alone.

Her employers told her the degree was a joke and they would even take a CSUN degree over that one. She was really torn up about it! :(

I agree that UoP is only out for the tuition and my mom is looking to apply with them and I'm making sure SHE DOESN'T!!!

horrible August 26, 2010 at 4:22 a.m.

this school is a money grubbing suck heap. any one can get in if they can pay. too bad, what a waste of human energy.

Check your school before paying August 26, 2010 at 8:22 p.m.

I can not beleive people still go to this school. What is wrong with the world. And you are defending it. To everyone that has gone here and received a good job congrats! You are lucky and prob have a great work history. Tips for find a good school. Online is ok if it is AACSB approved and if you contact your locate University not community college and ask if they would accept the Undergrade degree for their masters program. Gasp! No they wouldnt no if that was aceptable would they Gasp! No University is going to accept a crap school. And if you are going for your Masters or PHD...... Contact locate business and colleges and ask them if they would employ someone with your work history and education when completed form this aacsb onlin school.

Joey August 27, 2010 at 7:01 p.m.

University of Phoenix is a legitimate school that makes itself available to anyone who wants to pursue a higher education. How is that a bad thing? If someone wants to learn, why not give them the opportunity? There are requirements that students need to fulfill, such as a 2.0 GPA for undergraduates and a 3.0 for graduate students. If you fall below that GPA you will be put on academic probation, just like you would at a traditional brick and mortar state school. I was reading above that the teachers at University of Phoenix are pressured to have their students pass. All I have to say about that is - what teacher isn’t? Every teacher who is passionate about what they do want to teach their students more information. They want their students to succeed; they want their students to learn. When I got my bachelors degree from Arizona State University, I came to the conclusion that teachers are more of a mediator, you really learn from everyone. Your teacher leads the class but you really learn from your classmates, that’s why I believe the learning teams are put into University of Phoenix. They want you to have contact with your peers.
Any education is a valuable one, and just because University of Phoenix will accept almost anyone that doesn’t mean that it is a bad thing. They are still a regionally accredited school (which is the highest accreditation that any school can get by the way). They have their accreditation through the Higher Learning Commission (HLC) and are a member of the North Central Association of Colleges and Schools. University of Arizona and Harvard have their regional accreditation through the same commission, to give a quick example.

UOP is ruining online education August 28, 2010 at 4:12 a.m.

UoP is ruining other online schools good reputation like TUI, Capella, and the likes. I really do hate UoP. Everywhere I look, there's an ad for that crap school. "Hey, go to school here, where our minimum wage adjunct professors will give half a damn about you, and give you a horrible education why our fat cat Apollo group CEOs rake it in" What a freaking joke. BUYER BEWARE.

Accreditation? August 29, 2010 at 3:54 a.m.

Please do not get accreditation and quality mixed up. Accreditation means you are doing what you say you are doing, not validating the quality of the education. It is no different than Walmart saying they are selling cases of beer made by Budweiser. It is validated that Bud made the beer Walmart sells, but that says nothing of the quality of the product. Quality comes from professional accreditation like AACSB, ABET, etc. (which UoP has none). Why does UoP not have these? Argue all you want that "it is not what they set out to do," but in reality, they would never meet the number of full time professors required to make the accreditation. The school is really the Walmart of education.

Not accredited August 29, 2010 at 2:15 p.m.

Beware, this UoP business school is not AASCB accredited. UoP is not a member, nor in the process of obtaining this accreditation, that would make their curriculum harder, and cost them millions. Your MBA from here is laughed at.

Joey response August 31, 2010 at 4:13 a.m.

UoP is accredited every year by the North central association of colleges. All other good schools (normal) are accredited by North Central Assoc of colleges every TEN YEARS. If you have to be looked at yearly, it means you are on the fringe of losing your accreditation (ask any academic this question). If you are only accredited every 10 years, it means you have a solid foundation, and can be trusted to be a true academic institution. UoP is on the verge of losing big time. It sucks, and its accreditation is always teetering, with the sword of Damocles waiting to fall on its head. UoP is a business to make money, plain and simple. It sucks.

CCP August 31, 2010 at 12:16 p.m.

Regional accreditation, on the other hand, is the standard recognized by most traditional colleges and universities, and is therefore more widely accepted. Both national and regional accreditation is recognized by the U.S. Department of Education, but regional accreditation makes it easier to transfer college credits to other regionally accredited institutions.
Why is Accreditation Important?
According to the US Department of Education, college accreditation is used by both students and universities to:
• verify that a college or university meets established standards.
• help students identify acceptable colleges or universities.
• help colleges and universities determine the acceptability of transfer credits.
• establish goals to raise the standards among educational institutions.
• establish criteria for professional certification and licensure and for upgrading courses offering such preparation.
• establish a basis and criteria for receiving federal financial assistance and student aid.
You can check your school's accreditation by visiting the following:
• Middle States Commission of Higher Education
• Northwest Commission of Schools & Colleges
• North Central Association of Colleges & Schools
• New England Association of Schools & Colleges
• Southern Association of Colleges & Schools
• Western Association of Schools & Colleges
To check distance learning accreditation, visit:
• The Accrediting Council for Independent Colleges & Schools
• The Distance Education & Training Council

Institution: University of Phoenix
General Information
4635 East Elwood Street
Phoenix, AZ 85040-1958
Phone: 480-804-7600

Institutional Accreditation * denotes an estimated date
Agency Name
North Central Association of Colleges and Schools, The Higher Learning Commission
Accredited * 01/01/1978 -

Specialized Accreditation * denotes an estimated date

Commission on Collegiate Nursing Education
Nursing (CNURED) - Nursing education programs at the baccalaureate degree levels Accredited 09/29/2005 -

Nursing (CNURED) - Nursing education programs at the graduate degree levels Accredited 09/29/2005 -

Teacher Education Accreditation Council, Accreditation Committee
Graduate Teacher Education Accreditation Council (GTEAC) - Graduate programs Pre-Accredited * 12/01/2007

The university is not accredited for business or IT. DO the homework. It is accredited for nursing specialties and education... -

ccp August 31, 2010 at 12:25 p.m.

To the nasty negative people here. Go to the US Dept of Education OR the Education Connection so see the information posted. This is real information and not simply made up. I am not lying...

AASCB September 1, 2010 at 4:33 a.m.

No, UOP is not AASCB accredited. That means its business degrees are not accepted in the business world. Plain and simple, go ahead, look it up. The .99 cent store of business schools.

Alayna September 1, 2010 at 8:45 p.m.

@AASCB so which online schools are similar to Nordstrom or Macys?